Bettleboxs Breakdown of Zlines and MoMos

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speed26
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Postby speed26 » Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:22 pm

Nice thread you got going BettleBox :)

I myself still learning the ins and outs of it all, but i do agree that any and all succesful approaches (!) are based on momentum and exhaustion.

No matter how big or small a timeframe, all patterns will repeat infinitely, the only thing that changes is the size (magnitude) of the pattern.

Looking for entries on a smaller TF (to reduce risk) and focusing on a bigger TF (to increase returns) makes complete sense.

Of course, entry is only half the equation, you can have best entries in the world but if your exits are crap, then its pointless.

Entry AND exit is fundamental to success, they go hand in glove.

So we have multiple different 'types' of entries, which means there are multiple different types of exits aswell. And we all struggle with exits (!).

Here are some pics id like to share on how im currently seeing things.
When using lines based on candle closes, extremes/patterns/momentum stands out fairly well (in my eyes). These pics are renko (2tick / 5tick).

By no means am i a pro yet, just learning the ropes...
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loggerjim
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Postby loggerjim » Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:39 pm

prochargedmopar wrote:
dojirock wrote:
MightyOne wrote:I don't know why you guys make trading so damn difficult:

Image


Amen brother!


The same reason it takes "most" traders that are going to be successful 3-7yrs.

It took Dragon33 5yrs before profiting handsomely.
Doji has just recently started cranking it up and he became a member here in 2009. (I'm sure he's still workn' the day job atm)

I can't recall ANY traders that have gone from 40hr+ a week worker to Big bucks trader in 2 yrs.

Anyone have an example out of the millions of traders on the planet?



Poipen started with $400.00 in his account and grew it to 6 figures in about a year.

I have a feeling that it's going to take me a couple of years and a couple of blown accounts to start being consistently profitable. The way I look at it, the blown accounts are discretionary income which I see as paying for my education. A small cost now for a greater reward later.
Success is the progressive realization of a worthy goal

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bettlebox
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Postby bettlebox » Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:40 pm

Just recording this here of my thoughts. It is worth noting.

Very interesting article on basics of trading.

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthrea ... genumber=1

From Reading different opinions of other successiful traders they all talk about the same thing, be it in different details. The underlying concepts are all the same, and from my own humble exprience this is holding true.

Barry Burns
calls em the 3 energies
a).Trend
b).Cycle
c).Support and Resistance

Nial Fuller
a). Trend
b). pullbacks
c). key levels

Sam Seidan Supply n Demand
a). Trend is function of weather S/D is holding or breading
b). highest probability setups are on retracement back to a fresh S/D area.
c). S/D areas act as Support and Resistance.

The MightyOnes Zlines
a). Trend is function of Momentum
b). As profit is generated it will in time be elminated (cycle)
c). Origin of Momentum is Support and Resistance.

The Rumpled Ones The Rat Trade
a). Trend - doesn't care.
b). Underlaying principle - as price makes extremes it has to retrace.
c). support n resistance - doestn't care.

There is few more i could mention but they all talk about same thing
a) identify Trend
b) understand where you are in regard to market cycles.
c) understanding where price will stop and turn in cycles or support and resistance.

I think biggest mistake people make is they get there timing wrong ie they enter a trade and then price comes back on them and knocks out there s/l only then to have market move in the direction they wanted it to go.

What im sayin is you need all 3 components to have a high probability trades, me personally i have mixed sam seidens stuff with MOs zlines. The 2 are so close in ideas that they naturally fit together extremely well.And it works for me. I identify direction for 4hr from 1hr Momos and i will analys 4hr,1hr and 15min cycles.

Why do i anayls all 3 timeframes?One i don't want to trade slap bang in to a higher timeframe orderzone, and use the 1hr and 15min to fine tune my enter in direction of higher time. Countertrend trades will come naturally as you develop.

Well The Rumpled Ones Rat Trade is just pure genius, this exception to all 3 requirements. :D . Its rock solid in it underlying principle.

Its like that article from elitetrader says, if you get it-how all 3 components work together then everything else in trading will fall into place.

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Postby bettlebox » Mon Dec 24, 2012 1:59 pm

I have been going over trying to put in simple terms what i feel is critical to my trading. Everything else in regard to these are support money management , entries etc. If you dont have all 6 these then you will struggle or it will take you a long time to learn the lessons needed to progress.

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Postby bettlebox » Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:26 pm

I been do research into Memories and Fear over xmas. I was reading "The Disciplined Trader by Mark Douglas"

I did these pictures to help me understand how his concepts fit together and how we can correct/manage our mental enviroment as traders. Take on the number killer for a trader "FEAR".

I will do some more pictures relating to my personal exprience with "FEAR OF LOSING" for time been thought someone might find my notes helpful.

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Postby bettlebox » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:42 pm

Ok so here my personal exprience with "FEAR OF LOSING". There actually 3 parts this fear

1)entries
2)holding
3)exits

The exits was tough one cause of the "profits" as well the risk of your own trade capital. But by applying the method to take energy away from the fear (as explained in previous post) rapid progress can be made.

I also want to talk about importance of adapting your mental env. and how your belief structure restricts your view of external world and why that is important. I will talk about these in the next post.

SECRET is all in the awareness.



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Postby bettlebox » Tue May 28, 2013 8:07 pm

I been study how to think like a market maker. One key question to ask yourself is "How is the Market Makers going to profit from the current chart".

Remember a Zline shows you where held profit is on the screen.

And its commerical suicide for market maker once they have accumlated buy or sell orders in an area and start moving away from that area to suddenly stop and reverse go other way.

I seen nice analogy that trading is like plot to a story, at what point do you know what the story is? Thats point you take your trade.

Accumulation----Manipulation----Distrubition these are 3 phases the markets works on.

Knowing which phase the markets in and asking how are they going profit shifts your focus away from the illusions on your screen.

here is simple example of how market makers manipulate price to accumulate orders with out buyin. Stop running If start looking for these stop running at point congestion they can clues to accumulation and also zlines. Price wicking and take out previous swing lows at zlines is stop loss been taken out and accumulation move. Dead give away to what they are up to.

This is new topic for me so im still learning this feel free to comment.

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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue May 28, 2013 8:46 pm

Nice fat cat pic :)

Looks about right IMO
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Postby bettlebox » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:30 am

Possible permutations 1,2 and 3 timeframes and what you should be thinking. Obviously watch your zlines.

Might be single or combined candles.


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Postby bettlebox » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:42 pm

Currently reading:

If you are into trading psychology and coaching yourself there is this website 1000s of blog posts.

http://traderfeed.blogspot.co.uk/

The guy who made this blogsite also condensed all the posts into a book

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Daily-Trading-C ... 0470398566
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