2011.01.04 THE RAT ADAPTS

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bredin
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Postby bredin » Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:13 am

newscalper wrote:Bredin said about price going to the opposite extreme then coming back across the open.

5 min chart, yellow line = weekly open. Look for daily rat then observe, the trade here is on the third day. The chart shows a nice win, lots of trades don't win but I don't want to post that chart.

I think you must to be prepared to place more than one trade a day but not overtrade, maybe limit to only one per hour when price is crossing the daily open.

I see many trades that don't work but also many that make a large profit, statistics on this are???

Trade management is key and your rules for exit. I don't agree with 'if you see 2 pips it's a win' etc (sorry TRO) because if you think like that you don't know when to hold and when to fold, or with trailing stop at 5 pips etc. you'll get crazy stopped out: isn't Zline about that? But I also see that by averaging out you can sometimes hold on all day or even for days with little risk :shock:, which is what I was talking to TRO about b4 Xtmas in 2%. i.e. if we know the probability of our trade going + pips before our stop we can take off part of our position and hold. It's the missing part of the puzzle.


what if you scaled in rather than out?? putting profit into more position during the big run.... only putting a small portion on the table in the first place so as to reduce whipsaw (if thats an issue for you)



OEF is about 80% true for all bars regardless of timeframe, most of the fails are non-momo, small bodied bars...
I just meant it to be used here as a 'waiting' mechanism, very few daily bars have the open as an extreme....
Just for kicks take a look at rat style entries for m5/15 setup bars that close across the daily open :lol:

G.

edit: I love the rat for entries, btw... not meaning to hijack a thread with my acute cases of rat-abuse.
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Postby wangyue22 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:53 am

thanks TRO for your reply. got it now. utilizing this in combination is very useful for stress free trading. ^.^
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Postby TheRumpledOne » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:09 pm

pa wrote:Here's an issue I've noticed. Please correct me if my assumptions are wrong. It's a crap shot on whether price will continue in the intended direction in order to bank a profit.

Sometimes it does; sometimes it doesn't. Net/net, unless a runner is found, your stop-outs will slowly eat away at your brick of cheese.


You could have take a 2 pip gain instead of a 10 pip loss.
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Postby wangyue22 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:27 pm

well pa, thats where the greed emotion of human comes in, as TRO would say "if price is not going for you, the price is going against you" price doesnt sit there and do nothing.

on another note of price is the same, i agree that price is the same on all levels but rather the level of compression is different.
daily candles are just a more elaborate data compression compare to a 5 minute candle (micro-villies (tick) relative to the intestines (daily candle), -.- sorry my major in college was science)

what i was saying earlier is that since a daily candle versus a 5 minute candle is just a higher compression relatively, one can utilize this fractual nature of the market to his/her advantage.

for example, if you still have another job or have school and not a full time trader, any profitable method can still be used on a daily candle the same way you would do for a 5 minute candle. since the level of compression is higher for a daily candle (range), you just need to adjust your position size (SL) accordingly

if your method doesnt work on all time frames, then it is a method that is doomed to fail sooner or later.

just helping here, any feed back would be appreciated, especially the ones that goes against my current perspective ^.^
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Postby tfg » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:17 pm

But the SL, in this adapted daily BZ RAT, according to TRO is still 10pips.

wangyue22 wrote:well pa, thats where the greed emotion of human comes in, as TRO would say "if price is not going for you, the price is going against you" price doesnt sit there and do nothing.

on another note of price is the same, i agree that price is the same on all levels but rather the level of compression is different.
daily candles are just a more elaborate data compression compare to a 5 minute candle (micro-villies (tick) relative to the intestines (daily candle), -.- sorry my major in college was science)

what i was saying earlier is that since a daily candle versus a 5 minute candle is just a higher compression relatively, one can utilize this fractual nature of the market to his/her advantage.

for example, if you still have another job or have school and not a full time trader, any profitable method can still be used on a daily candle the same way you would do for a 5 minute candle. since the level of compression is higher for a daily candle (range), you just need to adjust your position size (SL) accordingly

if your method doesnt work on all time frames, then it is a method that is doomed to fail sooner or later.

just helping here, any feed back would be appreciated, especially the ones that goes against my current perspective ^.^

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Postby tfg » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:23 pm

I notice that dependent of which brokers you use, we will have daily candles closing at different timezone and therefore, our daily chart may not look the same.

My broker is GMT +2 and when the daily candle close (EST 17:00), the market begins to enter a thin-volumed, range-bound period which is not too suitable for the adapted RAT?

Any comments please.

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Postby pritam1232007 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:38 pm

TRO use MBT meta trader i think we need to follow his GMT....

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Postby wangyue22 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:00 am

well, if price is within 20 pip of day's low, its within 20 pip of day's low no matter what.

what i was inferring to is the fact of using the reversal method of price > last green candle high = buy.
this currently is being used on 5 min charts as intraday trading, for those who are not full time trader, this can also be used by using any time interval candles such as daily/weekly, so that they wont really have to check the chart very often.

yes, according to brokers the candle open/close could be very different, this goes back to the point of TRO saying that price is the same on all intervals, but overall, the outcome should be one and same.

today, you are a bit late, you didnt make the money, today you are a bit later, you didnt lose money, today you are a bit early, you made money, today you are a bit early, you lost money.
its one and the same over the long hull, its just that where the data compression begins/ends is different depends on where you reside.

a person living in Australia will start their daily candle earlier than us, it could be a good thing if he gets in early and correct, but it could also be a bad thing if he gets in early and he is wrong.

this then goes back to the very fundamental:
if price is not going lower, its going higher.
I mean, does that quote apply only in Sydney or is it universal? ;)

this could also be applied another way for people who are currently intraday trading. yes, the price is 20 pip within day's low, but the definition of day is relative, and since there are three major forex sessions in the world, you really could use the rule "20 pip within day's low" 3 different times within 24 hours (just pretend you are trading in asia, europe and united states every 8 hours ^.^)


o.O could be wrong, but it makes sense to me?
Last edited by wangyue22 on Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby pritam1232007 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:11 am

senior members please correct me .......
so if the price go in your favour, you will only get one entry.. am i right because price will not come back to the buy zone again...
what's the take profit if your stop loss is only 10 pip...i think exist is very difficult..
i think we should use trailing stop ...

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Postby wangyue22 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:17 am

again, i am not a senior member, but what i can tell you is this, very simple:

1. if price is not going for you, its going against you,

2. if price is not going higher, it must wants to go lower.

and no, i believe you can get multiple entries, because of number 2
and when the "exit" (not exist ^.^) is up to your greed, but when you see number 1, i suggest you get the F out. 5 minute is all about momentum, if price wants to shoot through the roof, it will do it in relative short period of time, if price wants to retrace up, retrace up, you probably will get a better chance if you just sold and waited

just my 2cent (1 penny now in the united states)


and not to be rude, pritam1232007,

have you finish reading drain the bank thread by TRO (post by post), these question were answered multiple times in that 280 page thread. no effort = no gain (world is simple if you want to see it that way)

also, if ANYONE can tell you exactly where to exit, they can go buy a million dollar house, purchase a jet and buy the world in a couple of years. we only choose where to enter, but we can never know where the market will go for sure.

edit: i feel so stupid sometimes, i guess thats arrogance for you -.-

mostly, all the answer you seek is in this forum, and I am sorry, no one is gonna spoon feed you here, even if we did, you wont really learn it conceptually because it came too easy
Last edited by wangyue22 on Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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