Why You Lose At Trading

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ajaymein
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Postby ajaymein » Thu Nov 18, 2010 9:39 pm

maddman wrote:I advise you to READ: "Trading In The Zone" by Mark Douglas this may help prepare you for the trading climate.
Maddman


Very good book for trading...I am currently half way through reading it.

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TheRumpledOne
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Postby TheRumpledOne » Fri Nov 19, 2010 12:39 am

genlogins:

There is no magic indicator or book that is going to make you profitable. You have to become profitable. The first step is to control your losses. The last step is to control your losses. Every step in between is controlling your losses. Do you get the picture?

You can not make a trade a winning trade nor can you determine how much you can win. The only thing you can do with 100% certainty after you enter a trade is prevent it from losing more than a certain amount. That is the essence of trading.
IT'S NOT WHAT YOU TRADE, IT'S HOW YOU TRADE IT!

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PebbleTrader
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Postby PebbleTrader » Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:44 am

Excerpt from Art of the Trade:

"It specifically comes out in the markets this way: Since I'm constantly
losing, I should do something to improve my approach. I don't know
enough about ______ (fill in the blank)."

I'll give you a few; moving averages, retracements, point and figures,
W. D. Gann, parabolics, pattern recognition, RSI, stochastics, Elliot Wave,
how the pit works, the news, the fundamentals, the bonds, the beans,
and so on. When the loser says, "I don't know enough about _______ , "
what he is really saying is, "I expect that to make a difference." It doesn't
cross the loser's mind that this expectation is still inside a structure of
beliefs that the market doesn't function under in the first place. Hence,
he will always lose. More of the same. If he makes a winning trade he
will conclude it was because of the "should be doing" part. Therefore,
he will be more convinced of its validity. In any case, the markets don't
work that way. He has concluded they "must."

You want to learn so much about that loser's thinking that you
can spot him a mile away. The best place is in your own backyard.
Study your own thinking because right now it is identical to his. By
studying your own thinking, you will see how the other person thinks,
but from a new point of view. Once you know how that thinking (the
loser thinking) leads to losses, you can begin to see how to exploit that
for potential profits."
Last edited by PebbleTrader on Sat Nov 20, 2010 5:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.

xtremeforex
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Postby xtremeforex » Sat Nov 20, 2010 5:11 am

TRO,

Lets be real though. We both know there's ways of trading profitably without stop-losses provided we are content with accepting smaller profits relative to the total account balance.

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Postby bredin » Sat Nov 20, 2010 8:36 am

MO trades without a stop, think about HIS returns ;)

G.
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PebbleTrader
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Postby PebbleTrader » Sat Nov 20, 2010 5:18 pm

"The 1-tick chart is the REAL MARKET. Any other time period
is a conceptual representation of what occurred between 2
points in time." -TRO

TRO,

Could you elaborate on that?

Thank you
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genlogins
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Postby genlogins » Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:51 pm

Well, IMHO, The Tick, or 1second chart is the real value, and only accurate value.

From that data received by your trading station is converted into drawing lines and candles. The lines we call them indicators, and the candles are just a graphic design representation from where the actual true value of price have passed.

If you see price in any timeframe but on a Line Chart, than that line is drawed from the Close of previous price data at that particular second, to the next close at a particular second. Take M1 as example in line chart, price moves up to down, but never draws the line, that is until the 59seconds, where price closes at a certain value, and that value is connected by a line towards the last close 59 seconds of previous price M1.

When in Bar Chart, than price is drawed by the PC and left a designed pattern of a candle on the screen, instead of a straight line.


I have the Tick chart, from the Spalping days, ohhhhhhh the beauty.........
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The Way To Money Is Using Simplicity And Take Small Loses

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MightyOne
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Postby MightyOne » Sat Nov 20, 2010 11:38 pm

bredin wrote:MO trades without a stop, think about HIS returns ;)

G.


Which makes more sense?

a. If price is going higher then wicks are reaching higher

b. If price is going higher then candles are closing higher.

Would you define a bounce off a line, for a long trade, as:

a. price crossed the line and closed lower

b. price crossed the line but closed higher


Next question :lol:

Do your answers, your method of analysis, come into conflict with where your stop closes your trade?

If your money management comes into conflict with your analysis then how do you expect to be profitable?

a. "I knew that price was going higher (my analysis said so) but I got stopped out (because I am too dumb to make them work together)"

b. "I had an idea that price would move higher, but the chart informed me that it is highly probable that I am incorrect."

-If you use stops then you should forget about S&R and take whatever small profit comes your way.

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MightyOne
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Postby MightyOne » Sat Nov 20, 2010 11:44 pm

genlogins wrote:Well, IMHO, The Tick, or 1second chart is the real value, and only accurate value.

From that data received by your trading station is converted into drawing lines and candles. The lines we call them indicators, and the candles are just a graphic design representation from where the actual true value of price have passed.

If you see price in any timeframe but on a Line Chart, than that line is drawed from the Close of previous price data at that particular second, to the next close at a particular second. Take M1 as example in line chart, price moves up to down, but never draws the line, that is until the 59seconds, where price closes at a certain value, and that value is connected by a line towards the last close 59 seconds of previous price M1.

When in Bar Chart, than price is drawed by the PC and left a designed pattern of a candle on the screen, instead of a straight line.


I have the Tick chart, from the Spalping days, ohhhhhhh the beauty.........


Why is your rat spewing blood? :lol:

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TheRumpledOne
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Postby TheRumpledOne » Sun Nov 21, 2010 12:10 am

PebbleTrader wrote:"The 1-tick chart is the REAL MARKET. Any other time period
is a conceptual representation of what occurred between 2
points in time." -TRO

TRO,

Could you elaborate on that?

Thank you



Bars/candles have open, high, low, close for the time period.

That represents what happened during that time period.

A 1 minute chart has all the ticks that happened during that minute. It could be 1 tick or 1 million. But all you see is the open, high, low and close.

So it is a CONCEPTUAL REPRESENTATION of what happened during that minute.
IT'S NOT WHAT YOU TRADE, IT'S HOW YOU TRADE IT!



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