WHY DO YOU USE INDICATORS THAT...

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TheRumpledOne
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Postby TheRumpledOne » Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:12 pm

I started this topic (and others) to get traders to SEE the fallacies that have been perpetuated.

So long as traders believe that the 5 minute chart is some how different than the 60 minute chart which is some how different than the daily chart which is... then they are stuck in the "tar pits".

I want traders to SEE and UNDERSTAND it is all the same data.

In the time from TIME A to TIME B, there will be a high and a low. And no matter how you slice up the time from TIME A to TIME B, the high and low will be the same. That is the point I am making.
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Postby PebbleTrader » Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:41 pm

Thanks for sharing :)
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Postby newscalper » Mon Nov 18, 2013 12:51 pm

TheRumpledOne wrote:I started this topic (and others) to get traders to SEE the fallacies that have been perpetuated.

So long as traders believe that the 5 minute chart is some how different than the 60 minute chart which is some how different than the daily chart which is... then they are stuck in the "tar pits".

I want traders to SEE and UNDERSTAND it is all the same data.

In the time from TIME A to TIME B, there will be a high and a low. And no matter how you slice up the time from TIME A to TIME B, the high and low will be the same. That is the point I am making.

At which point you have to decide where TIME A and TIME B are to determine when you start and stop measuring, thus perpetuating the same illusion as you're still operating with a time slice....

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Postby MightyOne » Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:36 pm

TRO is saying that if you have a days worth of:
tick data
5 minute data
30 minute data
hourly
whatever
that each chart would have the same highest high and lowest low & that, no matter where you start/stop measuring, the H/L will be the same on all charts.

Yes, if you shift the data the highs and lows will be different, but if everything gets shifted to the same start time then the highs and lows are still the same on all charts.

He is not talking about interdimensional traveling, just highs and lows being equal within a time slice.

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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:26 am

Per what TRO / MO is saying:

It's been awhile since I looked at it, but I think that MT5 only uses one history file, M1?

And from that one data file, the other time frames are derived.

So that's another way to think about it.

It's all the same data...
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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:29 am

Just looked it up again:

"1.2. Advantage of One-Minute Bars. MetaTrader 5 offers an entirely new
principle of storing and passing price data. In the previous version, data on
different timeframes were transmitted to the terminals separately. Now,
the data is transmitted and stored only in the form of one-minute bars,
while higher timeframes are built based on the one-minute bars in client
terminals. This approach allows to substantially save traffic, because the
history is downloaded only once and applies to all periods. After
downloading the price history, the terminal will only download new data"
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Postby newscalper » Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:10 am

MightyOne wrote:TRO is saying that if you have a days worth of:
tick data
5 minute data
30 minute data
hourly
whatever
that each chart would have the same highest high and lowest low & that, no matter where you start/stop measuring, the H/L will be the same on all charts.

Yes, if you shift the data the highs and lows will be different, but if everything gets shifted to the same start time then the highs and lows are still the same on all charts.

He is not talking about interdimensional traveling, just highs and lows being equal within a time slice.


I know exactly what he's saying. But it only applies for all time slices, whatever they may be within the largest time slice, measured from A to B, change A and B and you have a different ultimate high and low in the period. It's still a period.. You say the daily. OK. When does the day start and end? Why is a 24 day bar that your chart gives you in Forex significant?
You know this full well MO :lol:

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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:44 pm

I don't know about MO, but I didn't understand what your last post was really saying...

It's more clear now.

That was kind of my point as well. Traders over value a close, just one tick out of hundreds to thousands, solely on what time it is on their watch.

Once we understand that the data is all the same and that the time slice doesn't matter...than we can discuss interesting solutions :)
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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:06 pm

The reason I mention it is because people talk about a Close, "Price closing over a line" like it is somewhat "magical". Like the "magic of fibo" or the "magic of the 100 period moving average", granted a Close is more valid than those since they actually are price. But is is just one price value of a recent possible hundred to thousand.

Is the time on your watch so magical and important that you would make important decisions from it?
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Postby PebbleTrader » Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:16 pm

If time cycles are so important...

Why not base your decisions on other natural cycles like moon phases or ocean tides?

One could create an offline chart that completed a daily bar with the changing moon phase.

You laugh, how silly! But the result would not be all that different than what you currently are doing...
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