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MightyOne
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Postby MightyOne » Mon Mar 30, 2009 6:59 pm

As es / pip said (paraphrased) "you don't understand because you are not drawing what you see on my charts onto your own."

Image

What am I thinking when I draw these lines?

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Postby MightyOne » Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:13 pm

None of those fancy trading methods even matter if you are the type to trade in one direction from a line that lasts for X, exit during corrections, & reinvest profits.

Only the goal matters, small profits are just a means to an end.

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Postby aVi » Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:06 pm

Hi guys

Wow, new here... took me forever and a day to finish this thread, but I'm thankful I did.

TRO, awesome stuff, as always!

MightyOne... you think you're so darn smart, don't ya? :roll: You disgust me...




I kid, I keed... :lol: , now that I got a better grasp on what you're doing (at least, I think I do... :o) I... I... I idolize you... :shock:

I don't say much, don't know what the hell else valid I could add on after what these guys have done, I'd sound like a moron :cry: ... anyway, just wanted to say thanks. Also to es and xmess, they've offered some great help too. I'm along for the ride...
Wake up Mr. Green...

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Postby prochargedmopar » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:07 pm

prochargedmopar wrote:Let me first say that I am very fortunate and amazed that you take as much time as you do to write all this stuff out.......It's a lot and very much appreciated.

MIGHTYONE:
I just dont get it, I really don't

So I am going to lay out the frame work for profiting in a such a way
that can be accomplished by anyone:

1. Which way is price likely to move in the long term (more on this later). Not sure How can I know?

2. How small can I make my stops (you would be surprised)
I'd say 5 pips Min from what I see.
3. Risking 1% per trade/chart enter with the momentum of the small time frame. After looking at higher setup?

4. Exit all when you feel that price is likely to reverse and add that profit to your SL amount less commission.

EXAMPLE: 10 pips = 1%: You make 15 pips on a short and exit as the market starts to reverse. The next trade you risk your initial 10 + the 15 gained from shorting less 1 pip for commission to re enter.
Perfectly clear, gotta get some profit first. LOL

5. Price starts heading in the long term direction and again you get an entry to short on your small TF. You short with your 25 pip stop and the market starts stalling at +7 so you exit (you are at +32).
What's long in relation to what's short?
Price retraces 45 pips and you believe price is again heading south so you short again on you small TF with a 31 pip stop.

7. YOU CAN ONLY EXIT WHILE IN PROFIT OR GET STOPPED OUT!
Fine, Some would say it's only the "houses" money anyway, I disagree but OK.
Price retraces 27 pips and then turns around and plummets 74 pips.

What time frame are your trading? It was 1's and 5's but now I'm trying 5's and 15's. What does that chart look like? A Mess!
How many bars has it been since you first started shorting?
See below. ;)
Trade NO MORE THAN 2 bars of any time frame!
How did we just ride the 74 pips on 2- 5m bars???
8. You either reach your goal and make 7, 15, 26, 52, or 80%+ on your account or you lose 1%.

By reinvesting profit, having an unwillingness to let price trade to your stop while you are were profit at some point, and by sticking to a goal knowing that PRICE DOES MOVE HUNDREDS OF PIPS EVERY DAY (just about) then you will reach the goals you set out to attain and your losses
will cause you great laughter.
My new goal starting last week has been 25% at 50 pips. 10 pips =5%. I'm getting greedyer as I see you guys making 50 with ease......1 trade after the other.
3clipz calculated the e/u moved 10,000 pips in 24hr period. If it moved 5 pips a minute it would be 7200 pips movement.
Think and grow rich PRO
Thinking may be getting me into trouble.

That looks like an 8 steps to riches program but I do not see a #6. TRO said I need an I.A. program. (Indicators anonymous)
Even without the #6 is still looks like a 10step program...Thankyou, My name is.........I'm an.....


How powerful is color that we should buy if its green or sell if its red?

How powerful is the line that leads us to believe that price is supported or resisted?

How powerful is the indicator that lulls us into believing that
every thing will be ok if we just follow its magic.
These seem like rhetorical questions after the last one.....

EVERY OBJECT ON YOUR CHART HAS A POWERFUL IMPACT ON YOUR
PERCEPTION!
Do you mean the indy's give me a mis-perceptional?
If you sat down to trade and bought on a green candle could it decline or change to red before it closes?
YES!! is does.
Hour, four hour, daily, weekly, monthly, yearly, what do these mean to you?
LIfe's short, but not much if I'm trading a tick chart....
No matter the time frame and no matter the color price will either go up or go down from the time you sit down to trade to the time
you get up.

In the beginning it may go up and down, but price cannot run horizontally for long periods of time in fact price moves up or
down by hundreds of pips most every day.

Do you want hundreds of pips?
MORE!!
How about hundreds of pips while using a 10 pips stop?
EASY. Once I get this figured out.
The secret to surviving is to reinvest your gains into your stop.
Let price retrace and then trade in the same direction with the
larger stop.
Keep reinvesting your profits into your stop and do not exit
without new profits or move your stop closer.

WHATEVER YOU ARE RISKING YOU ARE RISKING!
Great, What direction do I trade?
If you risk 2% over 10 pips and add 20 pips in profit then
you are risking the initial 10 and the 20 pips for a 30sl.

If you risk 10 pips every trade without inflating it with profit then you may find your self getting whipsawed and no one can recover from that.

If you increase your SL to 20 and then take 20 pips in profit then
you are going to risk all of your profit on the next trade for another
mediocre profit.
Even if you made 40 pips you are risking half your profit and for what, a 2 to 1 return?
Even if you go for big pips you just sliced your profit potential in half!

By reinvesting your profit back into your stop you give your self "option like" staying power.
You use your day trading abilities to make a push on a small TF
and then you retreat (stay out DO NOT REVERSE!) as the animals give chase. Add more pips to your armor and then advance.

Keep retreating, adding, retreating, & adding until you reach your goal or your line dissolves.
Gotta know which way to attack and which way to retreat
What line?

The line that tells you which way your are trading!

This one:
Is this the one that I popped when I sat down, What's with the "line ends in 480min.?
I see know one else took you up on your challenge and I fissiled quickly as I was blinded by all the bright lights and glamour.
Time to reconsider.



You are not here trying to make Baby Pips (there is another forum for that) you are trying drain all the cash right out of the pockets of the Illuminati.

At 1% a 100 pip gain is a profit of 20%
At 2% a 100 pip gain is a profit of 40%
5% =10 pips 100pips 50%
At 1% a 300 pip gain is a profit of 60%
At 2% a 300 pip gain is a profit of 120%
5%=10 pips 300pips =150% as I see it.
Risking even 0.5% per trade and reinvesting profits until
you reach your goal is enough to make the same as a trader
risking 5% per trade in and out of the market.

Please tell me which way to trade and we'll do it.
I sat down and popped a line on this chart at the price I saw. The blue one.
All the indicators and the trend looked to be up BIG TIME but price was going down. Took 2 trades long and lost on both. -9.6 and -6.1. The first trade I sat through 6 -5m bars while it was building an ascending triangle and never saw more than +1. Took me a while to trade against the trend but when I finally did I made 11 pips. Only took z-line type trades. The first pic my trade was on the 2nd candle short that I rode down after being stopped out long. It looked as though the triangle would break up but it didn't even give me a chance to stop out with less loss when it took off.
The 2nd pic is how the day panned out, I did not take any more trades short as I thought we were up for the day. Had lots of opportunities to ride a couple reds here and there. How do I tell which way to trade with those BIG up pushes mixed in between the feeble but methodical down strokes??
Thanks.
Procharged.
BTW, cleaned up the charts a little more.

Image
Image


Ok,
So after all these questions I had within this post I basically Draw a line when I sit down and trade long above and short below?
Always adding profit to my stops of course until I hit my target %.
#1BODY in direction of profit #2INCREASE lot size Obsessively
My Losses cause me Great Laughter!
Trading Bible here> therumpledone/the-ideas-that-i-trade-by-t3256/page1670

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Postby pierre23 » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:19 pm

es/pip wrote:
pierre23 wrote:Short at 79, out at 02. A good gain.

Image

MO, you say to add profit to your SL and continue trading with the big picture. What happens if that retrace is large enough to hit your SL, does that not bring you back to square one minus your initial stop?

eg. If you risk 2% over 10 pips and add 20 pips in profit then
you are risking the initial 10 and the 20 pips for a 30sl.

The retrace hits your 30sl, taking you back to the start minus 10pips to your account.



:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

exactly

nice one


thank you, nice trades yourself in your recent posts :D but I think you already know that :P

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Postby pierre23 » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:38 pm

MightyOne wrote:
pierre23 wrote:Short at 79, out at 02. A good gain.

Image

MO, you say to add profit to your SL and continue trading with the big picture. What happens if that retrace is large enough to hit your SL, does that not bring you back to square one minus your initial stop?

eg. If you risk 2% over 10 pips and add 20 pips in profit then
you are risking the initial 10 and the 20 pips for a 30sl.

The retrace hits your 30sl, taking you back to the start minus 10pips to your account.


The only way price will ever reach your stop is if you entered and were not in profit to exit and inflate your stop.
On a large move against you you would be out and then you would re enter as it started to turn around.
Or you would be wrong immediately and let price move to your stop if that is where it was going.

Yes, you would lose 2%
...

What you are risking is what you are risking, you either make good entry decisions and take a profit before retrace or you might take a loss.

Too often traders say to them selves "ahh I'll move my SL to break even" or "I'll lock in a small profit" and they just let price come back
on them because they are comfortable.
If professional poker players are making more money than you then there is some thing seriously wrong with what you are doing!

If you were up 17 pips and price suddenly dropped to +9 you would not complain.

But If you exited at +17, increased your stop to 26 and reentered
at 9 suddenly you are thinking about how you were in profit and
might end up with a loss.

Is it not true that your intent was to hold to your target/goal?

Is it not true that price retraced lowering the probability that
you would achieve your goal due to a smaller market gyration taking you out?

Corrections in your account = The Anti Goal :evil:


I am only trying to retrain your mind for success :shock:

Once you understand the concept and plan your strategy around it
then you will no longer be dreaming of a 5% weekly gain (in fact you may even add zeros to it in reality).


I do see where you're coming from. Reinvesting profits into your stop gives you a better take in the market, allowing bigger retraces with only your initial risk of 2% and then heading back into the market to take more profit, rinse and repeat.

But imagine if you've done 5 great trades, reinvesting each time into your SL (and it has worked! the 3rd trade if you had not reinvested you would have been stopped out!). Now you're planning on one more trade to finish the day off. Suddenly the market completely changes against you -- smashes straight through your SL of the initial 2%+profit from 5 trades. After having a brilliant trading day, one bad trade takes you into minus 2% for the day.

I do see how it CAN help out by reinvesting - but maybe not all your profit?.. maybe 50 or 30% of your profit you can add to your next trades SL.. that way if you get stopped out you'll still be ahead.

comments?

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Postby MightyOne » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:50 pm

prochargedmopar wrote:
prochargedmopar wrote:Let me first say that I am very fortunate and amazed that you take as much time as you do to write all this stuff out.......It's a lot and very much appreciated.

MIGHTYONE:
I just dont get it, I really don't

So I am going to lay out the frame work for profiting in a such a way
that can be accomplished by anyone:

1. Which way is price likely to move in the long term (more on this later). Not sure How can I know?

2. How small can I make my stops (you would be surprised)
I'd say 5 pips Min from what I see.
3. Risking 1% per trade/chart enter with the momentum of the small time frame. After looking at higher setup?

4. Exit all when you feel that price is likely to reverse and add that profit to your SL amount less commission.

EXAMPLE: 10 pips = 1%: You make 15 pips on a short and exit as the market starts to reverse. The next trade you risk your initial 10 + the 15 gained from shorting less 1 pip for commission to re enter.
Perfectly clear, gotta get some profit first. LOL

5. Price starts heading in the long term direction and again you get an entry to short on your small TF. You short with your 25 pip stop and the market starts stalling at +7 so you exit (you are at +32).
What's long in relation to what's short?
Price retraces 45 pips and you believe price is again heading south so you short again on you small TF with a 31 pip stop.

7. YOU CAN ONLY EXIT WHILE IN PROFIT OR GET STOPPED OUT!
Fine, Some would say it's only the "houses" money anyway, I disagree but OK.
Price retraces 27 pips and then turns around and plummets 74 pips.

What time frame are your trading? It was 1's and 5's but now I'm trying 5's and 15's. What does that chart look like? A Mess!
How many bars has it been since you first started shorting?
See below. ;)
Trade NO MORE THAN 2 bars of any time frame!
How did we just ride the 74 pips on 2- 5m bars???
8. You either reach your goal and make 7, 15, 26, 52, or 80%+ on your account or you lose 1%.

By reinvesting profit, having an unwillingness to let price trade to your stop while you are were profit at some point, and by sticking to a goal knowing that PRICE DOES MOVE HUNDREDS OF PIPS EVERY DAY (just about) then you will reach the goals you set out to attain and your losses
will cause you great laughter.
My new goal starting last week has been 25% at 50 pips. 10 pips =5%. I'm getting greedyer as I see you guys making 50 with ease......1 trade after the other.
3clipz calculated the e/u moved 10,000 pips in 24hr period. If it moved 5 pips a minute it would be 7200 pips movement.
Think and grow rich PRO
Thinking may be getting me into trouble.

That looks like an 8 steps to riches program but I do not see a #6. TRO said I need an I.A. program. (Indicators anonymous)
Even without the #6 is still looks like a 10step program...Thankyou, My name is.........I'm an.....


How powerful is color that we should buy if its green or sell if its red?

How powerful is the line that leads us to believe that price is supported or resisted?

How powerful is the indicator that lulls us into believing that
every thing will be ok if we just follow its magic.
These seem like rhetorical questions after the last one.....

EVERY OBJECT ON YOUR CHART HAS A POWERFUL IMPACT ON YOUR
PERCEPTION!
Do you mean the indy's give me a mis-perceptional?
If you sat down to trade and bought on a green candle could it decline or change to red before it closes?
YES!! is does.
Hour, four hour, daily, weekly, monthly, yearly, what do these mean to you?
LIfe's short, but not much if I'm trading a tick chart....
No matter the time frame and no matter the color price will either go up or go down from the time you sit down to trade to the time
you get up.

In the beginning it may go up and down, but price cannot run horizontally for long periods of time in fact price moves up or
down by hundreds of pips most every day.

Do you want hundreds of pips?
MORE!!
How about hundreds of pips while using a 10 pips stop?
EASY. Once I get this figured out.
The secret to surviving is to reinvest your gains into your stop.
Let price retrace and then trade in the same direction with the
larger stop.
Keep reinvesting your profits into your stop and do not exit
without new profits or move your stop closer.

WHATEVER YOU ARE RISKING YOU ARE RISKING!
Great, What direction do I trade?
If you risk 2% over 10 pips and add 20 pips in profit then
you are risking the initial 10 and the 20 pips for a 30sl.

If you risk 10 pips every trade without inflating it with profit then you may find your self getting whipsawed and no one can recover from that.

If you increase your SL to 20 and then take 20 pips in profit then
you are going to risk all of your profit on the next trade for another
mediocre profit.
Even if you made 40 pips you are risking half your profit and for what, a 2 to 1 return?
Even if you go for big pips you just sliced your profit potential in half!

By reinvesting your profit back into your stop you give your self "option like" staying power.
You use your day trading abilities to make a push on a small TF
and then you retreat (stay out DO NOT REVERSE!) as the animals give chase. Add more pips to your armor and then advance.

Keep retreating, adding, retreating, & adding until you reach your goal or your line dissolves.
Gotta know which way to attack and which way to retreat
What line?

The line that tells you which way your are trading!

This one:
Is this the one that I popped when I sat down, What's with the "line ends in 480min.?
I see know one else took you up on your challenge and I fissiled quickly as I was blinded by all the bright lights and glamour.
Time to reconsider.



You are not here trying to make Baby Pips (there is another forum for that) you are trying drain all the cash right out of the pockets of the Illuminati.

At 1% a 100 pip gain is a profit of 20%
At 2% a 100 pip gain is a profit of 40%
5% =10 pips 100pips 50%
At 1% a 300 pip gain is a profit of 60%
At 2% a 300 pip gain is a profit of 120%
5%=10 pips 300pips =150% as I see it.
Risking even 0.5% per trade and reinvesting profits until
you reach your goal is enough to make the same as a trader
risking 5% per trade in and out of the market.

Please tell me which way to trade and we'll do it.
I sat down and popped a line on this chart at the price I saw. The blue one.
All the indicators and the trend looked to be up BIG TIME but price was going down. Took 2 trades long and lost on both. -9.6 and -6.1. The first trade I sat through 6 -5m bars while it was building an ascending triangle and never saw more than +1. Took me a while to trade against the trend but when I finally did I made 11 pips. Only took z-line type trades. The first pic my trade was on the 2nd candle short that I rode down after being stopped out long. It looked as though the triangle would break up but it didn't even give me a chance to stop out with less loss when it took off.
The 2nd pic is how the day panned out, I did not take any more trades short as I thought we were up for the day. Had lots of opportunities to ride a couple reds here and there. How do I tell which way to trade with those BIG up pushes mixed in between the feeble but methodical down strokes??
Thanks.
Procharged.
BTW, cleaned up the charts a little more.

Image
Image


Ok,
So after all these questions I had within this post I basically Draw a line when I sit down and trade long above and short below?
Always adding profit to my stops of course until I hit my target %.


I know that I didn't answer all of your questions.

You sit down and mark the current price.

Trade long above the line and short below.

Exit before corrections and add the profit to your stop less commissions.

Let price correct and then re enter as price moves your way again.

If price crosses the line the other way and you think that you see a trade
then trade in that direction.

Crossing the line does not represent a trade it is only there to reduce your options to a singe direction.


There will be some additions to this basic strategy later, but for now I am more interested in teaching you how to navigate the ocean to reach the new world.

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Postby Humble » Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:09 am

MO pity you didn't have your own thread for this. As it is your posts are intermingled with other trading ideas and indicators.

Others of your following are posting charts of successful trades, that seem to be using a reversal bar as the momentum bar, from which they place a trade. Is this correct? My understanding of a momentum bar would be that it needs to be a continuation bar.
Is price closing higher or lower than something? Simple yet powerful question. ..MO

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Postby prochargedmopar » Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:26 am

Thankyou Mightyone,
I will take up your Mighty line challenge again and keep posting the results in my log here:
http://kreslik.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1654
Thanks.
#1BODY in direction of profit #2INCREASE lot size Obsessively
My Losses cause me Great Laughter!
Trading Bible here> therumpledone/the-ideas-that-i-trade-by-t3256/page1670

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Postby pierre23 » Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:44 am

The 2% club chat room compensates for the lack of charts posted here using DTB or other methods of tro's, as they're traded successfully with him live most days/nights in the chat room. And if his posts werent 'intermingled' with other trading ideas and indicators on this thread, I don't think tro would have come up with the handful of indicators he did to implement with these methods.

From what I understand Momentum bar: current body = 2x previous bar body

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