Aliassmith Psychology 101 and other stuff

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1992 DREAM TEAM
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Postby 1992 DREAM TEAM » Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:35 pm

aliassmith wrote:
1992 DREAM TEAM wrote:
aliassmith wrote:So you think it is more about ignorance? If I know what I am doing but
refuse to take my money and run, it doesn't seem like ignorance fits
the bill. I stayed in because I "wanted" more not because I "expected"
more.


Hi alias -

I should have asked first, what does greed mean to you? When you found yourself thinking that price would keep moving with you, did you know that you were being greedy at the time?

I am saying that if I know I am being too greedy then I can either ignore the fact that I am too greedy and be doomed to repeat my mistake over and over again, or I could become less ignorant (or more aware, same thing), realize that being greedy is -EV, and make the appropriate correction. For me, it would be easier to use greed as a signal to watch out than try to suppress it entirely. But if I am being greedy without knowing it, then is that even really greed or just inexperience?

So whatever the mistake is, whether it be greed, fear, lack of experience, unexplainable irrational decisions, the faster I become less ignorant of my mistakes, the faster I correct them. I guess that is common sense but that is what I focus on to refine my decision making.

I guess if you are talking about greed like simply "I want more" then a rational mind will take the choice that pays off most efficiently. But if greed is a conscious effort to deny discipline, past experience, or even statistical data then it's really just ignoring better judgement.

IMHO all problems stem from some level of ignorance. So the goal is to be aware. Like I said, I don't know much about trading, so none of this may be relevant.

In terms of exits, it seems to me that it would be best to eliminate emotion from the equation entirely and just stick to a gameplan like TRO outlined somewhere in the rat threads.

I just hope I am on the right track LOL!

Thanks for the thought-provoking post.

:D


Just so you know I am not trying to attack/flame you, sometimes written
words can come across as such.

Ignorance:
1. lack of knowledge: lack of knowledge or education
2. unawareness: unawareness of something, often of something important

I put that definition so you understand where my belief system comes
from.

I believe the difference you and I have is you believe that the rational
mind will beat out emotion. I think it can of course, but without
conditioning, emotions can and will trump rationality.

"it would be best to eliminate emotion from the equation entirely" I agree
although this is a matter of conditioning.

Many people look for work-a-rounds to over come emotions. For example
"I"ll set this SL and TP and put myself in hand cuffs so I can't change
anything".

When I was a boy learning to ride a bike I was afraid of falling off and
getting hurt. I am confident that this is many people's experience. I could
not learn to overcome my emotion without riding the bike a few feet at a
time. Maybe actually falling off the bike and getting back on again. I
adapted as a human.

My point is I prefer to adapt to my emotional restraints and look at my
account balance all the time. I listen to my sub-conscience when it is time
to reduce risk. Emotions can be conditioned a small step at a time.

Anyway I am sharing "my" beliefs in hopes it will help others and of course
we all don't see things the same. :)


No worries my friend, maybe I just got excited because I had something to write about after weeks of reading. I understand the value of many perspectives and how difficult it is to be rational all the time. I think we are in agreement more than not. I know there is a lot to learn from the likes of you and others on this board.

I remember having the same experience with my bike. When I finally got it, it was because my dad was holding me up and I didn't know that he had let go, and I kept riding. And I promptly fell when I looked back! But I knew I could do it (thanks, Dad). I also know the first thing you are taught in judo is how to fall so that you don't get hurt when you get tossed. Then you learn how to fight.

When I think about greed, I wonder, is it different than fear of not having enough? Is losing any different than not winning? In my experience, seeing both sides but not the coin is what leads to one extreme or the other. Isolating one side could potentially have a whack-a-mole effect.

Failure to maintain a balanced perspective was my biggest demon because that's what allowed things like greed to get out of hand. Hopefully that means I don't have to tame the same demon again on this new adventure.

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aliassmith
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Postby aliassmith » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:04 pm

1992 DREAM TEAM wrote:
aliassmith wrote:
1992 DREAM TEAM wrote:
aliassmith wrote:So you think it is more about ignorance? If I know what I am doing but
refuse to take my money and run, it doesn't seem like ignorance fits
the bill. I stayed in because I "wanted" more not because I "expected"
more.


Hi alias -

I should have asked first, what does greed mean to you? When you found yourself thinking that price would keep moving with you, did you know that you were being greedy at the time?

I am saying that if I know I am being too greedy then I can either ignore the fact that I am too greedy and be doomed to repeat my mistake over and over again, or I could become less ignorant (or more aware, same thing), realize that being greedy is -EV, and make the appropriate correction. For me, it would be easier to use greed as a signal to watch out than try to suppress it entirely. But if I am being greedy without knowing it, then is that even really greed or just inexperience?

So whatever the mistake is, whether it be greed, fear, lack of experience, unexplainable irrational decisions, the faster I become less ignorant of my mistakes, the faster I correct them. I guess that is common sense but that is what I focus on to refine my decision making.

I guess if you are talking about greed like simply "I want more" then a rational mind will take the choice that pays off most efficiently. But if greed is a conscious effort to deny discipline, past experience, or even statistical data then it's really just ignoring better judgement.

IMHO all problems stem from some level of ignorance. So the goal is to be aware. Like I said, I don't know much about trading, so none of this may be relevant.

In terms of exits, it seems to me that it would be best to eliminate emotion from the equation entirely and just stick to a gameplan like TRO outlined somewhere in the rat threads.

I just hope I am on the right track LOL!

Thanks for the thought-provoking post.

:D


Just so you know I am not trying to attack/flame you, sometimes written
words can come across as such.

Ignorance:
1. lack of knowledge: lack of knowledge or education
2. unawareness: unawareness of something, often of something important

I put that definition so you understand where my belief system comes
from.

I believe the difference you and I have is you believe that the rational
mind will beat out emotion. I think it can of course, but without
conditioning, emotions can and will trump rationality.

"it would be best to eliminate emotion from the equation entirely" I agree
although this is a matter of conditioning.

Many people look for work-a-rounds to over come emotions. For example
"I"ll set this SL and TP and put myself in hand cuffs so I can't change
anything".

When I was a boy learning to ride a bike I was afraid of falling off and
getting hurt. I am confident that this is many people's experience. I could
not learn to overcome my emotion without riding the bike a few feet at a
time. Maybe actually falling off the bike and getting back on again. I
adapted as a human.

My point is I prefer to adapt to my emotional restraints and look at my
account balance all the time. I listen to my sub-conscience when it is time
to reduce risk. Emotions can be conditioned a small step at a time.

Anyway I am sharing "my" beliefs in hopes it will help others and of course
we all don't see things the same. :)


No worries my friend, maybe I just got excited because I had something to write about after weeks of reading. I understand the value of many perspectives and how difficult it is to be rational all the time. I think we are in agreement more than not. I know there is a lot to learn from the likes of you and others on this board.

I remember having the same experience with my bike. When I finally got it, it was because my dad was holding me up and I didn't know that he had let go, and I kept riding. And I promptly fell when I looked back! But I knew I could do it (thanks, Dad). I also know the first thing you are taught in judo is how to fall so that you don't get hurt when you get tossed. Then you learn how to fight.

When I think about greed, I wonder, is it different than fear of not having enough? Is losing any different than not winning? In my experience, seeing both sides but not the coin is what leads to one extreme or the other. Isolating one side could potentially have a whack-a-mole effect.

Failure to maintain a balanced perspective was my biggest demon because that's what allowed things like greed to get out of hand. Hopefully that means I don't have to tame the same demon again on this new adventure.


Not sure if it will take more conditioning or not. You will need to be aware
of it happening so you can tame the beast if it does rear its head. Which
it seems you have experience identifying.
Trade Your Way as Long as It Makes Money!

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Libertarian
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Postby Libertarian » Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:28 am

aliassmith wrote:I received this question in a PM. I figured I would answer it here as it
may help others.

You often us the terms "order stack" and "order stack areas". Can you define what you mean by this?

An order stack area is where I believe orders are bunched up and will
cause price to reverse. If you study many types of trades and how people
place and adjust their stop loss/entry orders you can get an edge from
this information.


You da man aliassmith!

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Postby aliassmith » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:24 pm

Libertarian wrote:
aliassmith wrote:I received this question in a PM. I figured I would answer it here as it
may help others.

You often us the terms "order stack" and "order stack areas". Can you define what you mean by this?

An order stack area is where I believe orders are bunched up and will
cause price to reverse. If you study many types of trades and how people
place and adjust their stop loss/entry orders you can get an edge from
this information.


You da man aliassmith!


I do what I can! :oops:
Trade Your Way as Long as It Makes Money!

aliassmith
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Postby aliassmith » Tue Mar 01, 2011 3:27 pm

aliassmith wrote:I received this question in a PM. I figured I would answer it here as it
may help others.

You often us the terms "order stack" and "order stack areas". Can you define what you mean by this?

An order stack area is where I believe orders are bunched up and will
cause price to reverse. If you study many types of trades and how people
place and adjust their stop loss/entry orders you can get an edge from
this information.


Order Stack Areas in yellow ellipse.
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Postby aliassmith » Fri May 20, 2011 5:21 pm

Good to see the site is back up 8)

I figured I would add a little something in appreciation!

As you can see in my signature line I believe in the concept of my
money and their money. Or instead of their money I call it discounted
money.

My trading edge stems from identifying order stack areas AKA as supply
and demand, zlines, ect.

Money management is key in the process. I risk the least when I have the
most to lose. Having the most to lose is when I only have what I brought
to the trading "table". This is usually around a month of trading I reset my
risk gearing. At this beginning I call this "my" money.

As I trade with low risk and good trades I build up about 4% return on
my starting equity. With this 4% discounted money I can build nice positions
and maybe a little more risky entries.

And that is the back bone of what I do.
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Postby PebbleTrader » Fri May 20, 2011 10:11 pm

I can see where the idea of "market money" can make sense. In particular if you are going to "aggressive push" the next trade. I used to not believe in the idea. Primarily, because if I did the work to create a good plan and execute winning trades, then I considered it "my money" at that point.

I've heard that traders who use the "market money" concept determine their account equity differently.

For example:

If you have $50,000 account equity and put on say a $5,000 position. You still have this position on and want to take another position, would you then base your account equity off of $50,000 - $5,000 (your open position) = $45,000 account equity for your next position? or would you still base it off of the $50,000?

Just curious.
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Postby aliassmith » Sat May 21, 2011 7:05 pm

PebbleTrader wrote:I can see where the idea of "market money" can make sense. In particular if you are going to "aggressive push" the next trade. I used to not believe in the idea. Primarily, because if I did the work to create a good plan and execute winning trades, then I considered it "my money" at that point.

I've heard that traders who use the "market money" concept determine their account equity differently.

For example:

If you have $50,000 account equity and put on say a $5,000 position. You still have this position on and want to take another position, would you then base your account equity off of $50,000 - $5,000 (your open position) = $45,000 account equity for your next position? or would you still base it off of the $50,000?

Just curious.


Actually my platform is set-up to make my position a certain size based on
my equity. I believe it is 4:1 leverage.

When I make 4% profit which could take a few days I will increase the
automatic setting by at least 25% more. As my profits increase I will move
by base risk up. When about 1 month is over I will gear my risk back down
to my 4:1 leverage.

I forgot to put this in my last post: My Influences
MightyOne - Kreslik.Com
es/pip - Kreslik.Com
Phantom of the Pits - Futures Magazine
FTI - ForexFactory.Com

MightyOne, Phantom, and FTI use some form of position gearing.
MightyOne and es/pip have some of the best entry techniques.
Trade Your Way as Long as It Makes Money!

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Postby pp2 » Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:04 am

Hello everyone, I'm still around, lurking, reading and digesting everything here. I'm not posting much as I knew from my skills I couldn't bring anything constructive back to help or to even ask questions.

I just wanted to vent an aha moment I had a few weeks back while visiting this forum, particularly this thread. While being stressed out looking for good entry points so I can make 2:1 over a fixed stop and getting mixed results, it just frustrated me to the point where I had enough and I just wanted to give the hell up. Then DING! the lightbulb just came on when I started asking ... How can I make money from trading? How can I do it safely?

I can show you all about entries but this isn't the magic I'm talking about, it is "manging money". This week I decided to try and trade the higher timeframes H1, H4, D1 and weekly with this aliasmith variation of space. I know in general MOs ideas but it helps me to understand the common sense of it without the maths which I really struggle on. Here's some answers I've come up with so far

*Use other peoples money, risk that money, and keep risking that money
*Either take a profit or take a loss

The guidelines for me to take a position was

1. I was prepared to take a loss of 5% for the whole week
2. Trade the move from the average weekly extreme to the next, in multiple trades.

P1 I risk x% of my base capital to make x%
P2 I risk only the profit I made in P1 (increase lot size)
P3 I risk only the profit I made in P1 and P2 (increase lot size more)
P4 I risk only the profit I made in P1,P2, and P3 (increase lot size more)
Go back to P1 recalculate with new account size.

On a live account roughly $1000

P1 --- risk my money of $50 with LIS --- Mon/Tues AU - 50 space, lot size $1=1pip, 50 pip target hit 5% risk --- gain $50 --- total money now is $1050

P2 --- risk other peoples money of $50 --- Tues/Fri U/CHF 50 space, lot size is $1=1pip, 65 pip target hit --- gain $65 --- total money now is $1115

P3 --- risk other peoples money of $115 --- Fri EU 50 space, lot size is 115/50=$2.3 per pip, 35 pip target hit --- gain $80.5 --- total money now is $1195.5

I traded a little on Friday so I didn't finish phrase 4 but even then I took three positions this week and my final account ended up 20%! Probably peanuts for you kreslik veterans but damn exciting to me, not just the percentage or pip win but but the almost stress-less part time trading over what I think are ok, about there entries and exits, and even if I did lose I was prepared to close out my position when something closed over my LIS. Loving trading again and looking forward to next week although worried about the liquidity this coming holidays.

Thanks alias for this watered down version and thanks MO for the space ideas. And thanks to everyone else for their entry ideas. Any comments is greatly appreciated.

Risking other peoples money is empowering!

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Postby dojirock » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:55 pm

Thats not peanuts! Fantastic. Always nice to see a plan and it being followed.
Thats what its about.....stay motivated and dont stray. Remember, your one week ahead of 95 percent of alll traders!

:D
"A small loss is just as satisfying as a large gain" -MO
"Sometimes we need to stop learning and start thinking...."
"Once you stack, you'll never go back!"

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