2009.09.10 DRAIN THE BANKS - LIKE A RAT

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johny
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Postby johny » Mon Feb 08, 2010 12:29 pm

Hi Gangsta1,

I see two loosers and two winners in those above charts by following that rule.

cheers

Johny

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gangsta1
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Postby gangsta1 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 12:58 pm

johny wrote:Hi Gangsta1,

I see two loosers and two winners in those above charts by following that rule.

cheers

Johny


Is this an obseration you made just from the charts I posted or something you see occur frequently?

2 losers + 2 winners would mean we would need to take proft greater than 10 to b/e or profit. I do find with DTB rev8/9 I exit trades when I can only to see the trades shoot for much more pips. Of course with a modest target of 10 pips daily one could exit once daily profit is reached, so if the first trade hits 10 then exit, if the first trade is a 10 pip loss then shoot for 20 on the next one and so on.. Any thoughts?

johny
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Postby johny » Mon Feb 08, 2010 4:29 pm

Thats from the charts you posted..

Why would you restrict the trade to 10 pip TP?

If you are trading a single position, I don't see any point in setting a fixed TP. You can split it to couple of positions and close one position at +10 and let the other run (some sort of positioning). Even one good run per week can make up many losses.

cheers

Johny

gangsta1
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Postby gangsta1 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 4:57 pm

I would restrict it to 10 pips as that is my daily target (2%). This target would not be restricted when losers have occured as my daily target will require more pips.

I know what you mean about the one good run. Its just that I believe the DTB method is meant for scalping few pips but I have noticed it can get me right in at the beginning of a big move. It just requires discipline and the right mentality to sacrifice small wins for the want of catching a big one.

My main issue with catching the runners is knowing when to set a break even. Setting a breakeven at 5 to 10 pips does prevent losers but also cancels out trades that would have gone on a run had a breakeven been set later. Perhaps another reason I opt for a 10 pip tp max.

I have been thinking due to my relatively modest trading account to only risk 1% per trade. In doing this my aim would be to catch a runner that makes up my daily target whilst also allowing me to incur more losses from not closing the "take what you can trades". I find it hard that my daily target from the previous day can be wiped out in one loser on the current day which is currently the case with my risk:reward of 2%/2%.

I see what you say about positioning. If I close half at 10 pips and allow the other 1% to run with a break even set then at worst I have made 1% on the trade which is half of my daily target and at best I could catch a good runner and make my daily target and then some. Is this a tactic that you adopt?

daveM
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Postby daveM » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:20 pm

When the market is not demonstrating a clear trend, it is sometimes hard to decipher the signals. It is then handy to have the 60 minute chart and perhaps back the 5 off to a 15. The 5 gives more entries,however, the signals are clearer on the higher TF.

I am not so sure that you should limit your TP to ten, a hard stop loss is required, the TP could be substantially greater.

Replay helps to clarify this system.

This URL will take you to something you can use for replay and also a sim broker

http://www.forexmt4.com/BacktestTrader/http://www.forexmt4.com/BacktestTrader/

A few hours of sim trading this setup each week will make things clearer and profitable.

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bredin
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Postby bredin » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:26 pm

gangsta1 wrote:Here is a screenshot of the EU today during London open. Red rats would have been stopped out 4 times consecutively (-40) chasing the daily high.



The EJ had 2 consecutive losses. Yes the third trade was a nice run but whilst adopting a take what you can policy, unlikely the whole move would have been caught. The purpose in me posting these charts is to discover if these entries could have been timed better and how - they follow the rules.



Several of those trades look like they are in profit at some point:
On EU the 2th and 4th trade offered definite opportunity to get out at b/e, the 1st the price stalled and was a warning to get out before the price moved against you (MOMO-stall-RevMOMO is a very common bar formation on all tfs) also could have dumped at b/e. The 4th is the only real loss on that pair- immediatly followed by 4 or 5 profitable entries two of them looks like being 10+ the others about 5..

On EJ trade 1 is the same as the first trade on EU, the second looks like a loss, but I dont know exactly how long price stalled at b/e. The next entry looks like, what, 50+?

gansta, it is about reading PA (Price Action) which you will learn in time: this is not a simple case of +/- 10 pips, "take what you can" is a definite skill.

Cheers
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johny
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Postby johny » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:29 pm

gangsta1 wrote:I would restrict it to 10 pips as that is my daily target (2%). This target would not be restricted when losers have occured as my daily target will require more pips.

I know what you mean about the one good run. Its just that I believe the DTB method is meant for scalping few pips but I have noticed it can get me right in at the beginning of a big move. It just requires discipline and the right mentality to sacrifice small wins for the want of catching a big one.

My main issue with catching the runners is knowing when to set a break even. Setting a breakeven at 5 to 10 pips does prevent losers but also cancels out trades that would have gone on a run had a breakeven been set later. Perhaps another reason I opt for a 10 pip tp max.

I have been thinking due to my relatively modest trading account to only risk 1% per trade. In doing this my aim would be to catch a runner that makes up my daily target whilst also allowing me to incur more losses from not closing the "take what you can trades". I find it hard that my daily target from the previous day can be wiped out in one loser on the current day which is currently the case with my risk:reward of 2%/2%.

I see what you say about positioning. If I close half at 10 pips and allow the other 1% to run with a break even set then at worst I have made 1% on the trade which is half of my daily target and at best I could catch a good runner and make my daily target and then some. Is this a tactic that you adopt?


Hi Gangsta1,

Stuff thats working for me....My SL is not fixed. I use Dragon MM with a maximum SL of 25 (trade through), riskpct of 4 and multiplier of 2, and split the resulted lot size into half to enter 2 positions. My SL is always high + 1 + spread / low - 1. If its > 25, I don't take the trade. TP is discretionary. If I feel fidgety I close both. Otherwise, close one position to eliminate complete risk and leave the other for few tens of pips.

P.S: I don't take DTB RAT just as it is.. I filter it by H1 candle colour and/or ZL.

cheers,

Johny

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Postby daveM » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:43 pm

Certainly as mentioned above, price action is key to all decisions, the indicators are indications of what the price bars are doing. TRO has tried to make this thing easy to follow but the price bars are what makes things happen.

You can believe that he does not require much in the way of indicators when he trades... and that he has created the indicators to help others learn to trade.... with the proviso that people are observing price action.

I would think that TRO has many years of experience watching price bars and S&R and has tried to draw a picture as to what is happening with these indicators but the trader is required to learn price action as TRO can not train a trader to do that.

He has created some candle wick indicators, wicks are significant, as are the NR bars.

gangsta1
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Postby gangsta1 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:57 pm

Thanks alot for the info guys. I have rigorously practiced DTB on demo, through using the trading simulator and live (with minimal risk). I think both rev8 and rev9 are excellent and put my hesitation of being successful with them down to not knowing when to exit.

Before I understood "take what you can" as literally leave the trade after a few pips, but as some of you have pointed out, there may be more opportunity depending on price action.

johny
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Postby johny » Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:27 pm

gangsta1 wrote:Thanks alot for the info guys. I have rigorously practiced DTB on demo, through using the trading simulator and live (with minimal risk). I think both rev8 and rev9 are excellent and put my hesitation of being successful with them down to not knowing when to exit.

Before I understood "take what you can" as literally leave the trade after a few pips, but as some of you have pointed out, there may be more opportunity depending on price action.


Hi Gangsta1,

May be you can consider trading/observing only one pair for few days/weeks. TRO suggested that in some of his posts and it helped me to a great extent.

cheers,

Johny

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