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dragon33
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Postby dragon33 » Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:27 pm

Jalarupa wrote:Nice Doji,

Looking forward to seeing you do this!

Remember Dragon style looks for H1 Momo and then rejection of the Zline or Mighty Zone in the candles that follow... The H4 charts are targets... also great to trade away from the zones in the direction of H4 MOMO... (I think this is where you went wrong in your EURO buy)

Peace dude and may you start seeing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow soon...


héhéhé where did i here that before :lol:

You can not trade safely against the trend without H1 mbar behind you.

Targeting is different for every trader and difficult to explain. Everybody should know that you need to cut your losses fast.

1) find a zeroline on higher frame
2) wait for momentum on H1
3) find rejection on momentumbar and take the trade.
Trading is like cycling, first you need to learn how.
Two options: you either lose or win!

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Jalarupa
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Postby Jalarupa » Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:51 pm

dragon33 wrote:
Jalarupa wrote:Nice Doji,

Looking forward to seeing you do this!

Remember Dragon style looks for H1 Momo and then rejection of the Zline or Mighty Zone in the candles that follow... The H4 charts are targets... also great to trade away from the zones in the direction of H4 MOMO... (I think this is where you went wrong in your EURO buy)

Peace dude and may you start seeing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow soon...


héhéhé where did i here that before :lol:



Ah yes, the humble student only repeats what he has already been taught by the master... ;-)

Love this method of trading... Throw in a line in the sand and you got the start of a beautiful trade...

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dojirock
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Postby dojirock » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:02 pm

thank you for your responses!

As I have some ah ha moments, I think I have it, get a great trade, and does it turn out to be luck? I have to wonder.

I review everything I think I know in my head and one by one make sure they are correct and hopefully all the pieces will work together someday!

I have to ask....
If, for your preferred terminology, mbars = MOMO, your definition is troubling...
Do I have that wrong?

This is what I think i know for sure....
Bodies in the direction of profit, they show you the way....
extremes are the wicks
If fails to close beyond the extreme after mbar.....then Key Reversal.
Doji

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dojirock
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Postby dojirock » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:21 pm

Yesterday as I wonder with amazement at es/pips 5 min scalping ability,
I notice some things that maybe everyday nature to most, but wasnt for me. But I need some verification please that im on the right track.

I have used sema's, up til now completely wrong....they are just markers in a sense of support and demand on a given time frame?
As i started drawing lines by hand, I notice that previous semas, when broken, are broken by mbars. This means to me it takes momentum to break a previous support or demand level?
If this indeed correct...then as it approaches a level...if momentum slows, look for a reversal. If it flies through then that previous support becomes resistance if price is going short and resistance becomes the new support if price is moving long? That break in the old support or resistance is done by an mbar which is around the 50% level....thus when it is valid price returns to that level then reverses which would be our entry point?
Am I even close....man I hope so...
Logically it makes sense to my trading method of why I am almost always on the wrong side of the trade, it goes againt me(the break out of support or demand) and then returns 50% to the mbar (which puts me close to break even) then takes off against me badly...that is why I have leaned to exit with a small loss in those senarios.

So the big question in my head...is how do I recognize the right side of the trade....this is where I am .

It may seem stupid but I now know what they mean by support and resistance being dynamic......when using those indicators...

Look forward to your input... Im on demo until i get this worked out..hehe

Doji

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Postby dojirock » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:34 pm

Here is a pic of the thoughts im trying to put into words...

Please comment.

Doji
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Jalarupa
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Postby Jalarupa » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:44 pm

dojirock wrote:Here is a pic of the thoughts im trying to put into words...

Please comment.

Doji


That is pretty much exactly how I trade this method... ;-)

I would just put a line in the sand in the H1 TF at the bottom support level if we were going long and then you cover yourself from the trade going bad

I liked your observation about the MOMO breaking the S&R Lines... :D

Thank you

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Postby FXfreak » Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:05 pm

dragon33 wrote:
Jalarupa wrote:Nice Doji,

Looking forward to seeing you do this!

Remember Dragon style looks for H1 Momo and then rejection of the Zline or Mighty Zone in the candles that follow... The H4 charts are targets... also great to trade away from the zones in the direction of H4 MOMO... (I think this is where you went wrong in your EURO buy)

Peace dude and may you start seeing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow soon...


héhéhé where did i here that before :lol:

You can not trade safely against the trend without H1 mbar behind you.

Targeting is different for every trader and difficult to explain. Everybody should know that you need to cut your losses fast.

1) find a zeroline on higher frame
2) wait for momentum on H1
3) find rejection on momentumbar and take the trade.


"find rejection on momentumbar and take the trade." means wait for pullback and look for a continuation in momo-direction?

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dojirock
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Postby dojirock » Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:17 pm

Here is a pic that fits what Dragon is talking about?
Zeroline, hourly mbar short.....pullback to 50 percent...and drop to shorter time frame...and look for short momentum?

doji
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Postby TygerKrane » Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:41 am

dojirock wrote:I have used sema's, up til now completely wrong....they are just markers in a sense of support and demand on a given time frame?

Just like TRO has an indicator TRO_PLOT that marks the high and low of the H4/D1/W1/MN1; Semas mark the high/low of a rolling period of candles {the three numbers you use in the settings}

:idea: johnsund :idea: wrote:Tyger - the semafor is an indication of a high or low "X" number of bars back. Standard settings are: 1 = 5 bars back; 2 = 13 bars back; 3 = 34 bars back. These are changable. So, if there is a 3 at the top of the chart it means that the price at the top of the bar/wick where the 3 is present is the highest price in the past 34 bars. This is the reason the semafors "repaint" They are an indication that price has hit a high/low for a specific number of bars back and during a given candle that price is on the move and may push the 1, 2 or 3 to its new level. It is NOT an indication of a reversal or anything else that some read into it. Merely the high or low of a certain number of bars back.


:idea: dchappy :idea: wrote:I have always viewed the semafor as an " area of exhaustion " and not a single point .

Using a " lagging " trigger , gives the semafor time to " settle - down " and confirm a reversal .


( Indicators give an "indication " of something that May or May not happen )


Just my 2 cents .. :lol:


The thread is a fun read if you still want to know a thing or two about Sema's...the thread starts off with some idiot spoutin' off some half-a$$ observations, and then later, more knowledgeable traders come in to set him straight.
Plus, you will no longer be among the ranks of the retards that cry about how it "repaints".


dojirock wrote:As i started drawing lines by hand, I notice that previous semas, when broken, are broken by mbars. This means to me it takes momentum to break a previous support or demand level?
If this indeed correct...then as it approaches a level...if momentum slows, look for a reversal. If it flies through then that previous support becomes resistance if price is going short and resistance becomes the new support if price is moving long? That break in the old support or resistance is done by an mbar which is around the 50% level....thus when it is valid price returns to that level then reverses which would be our entry point?
Am I even close....man I hope so...


Looks like you and I both are busting our heads trying to figure out how to handle a failed S&R trade; and how to spot a failed vs successful S&R trade from a mile away. Just keep in mind that even the best of observations and note-taking will yield no holy-grail for those situations, ANYTHING CAN STILL HAPPEN!!


dojirock wrote:Logically it makes sense to my trading method of why I am almost always on the wrong side of the trade, it goes against me(the break out of support or demand) and then returns 50% to the mbar (which puts me close to break even) then takes off against me badly...that is why I have leaned to exit with a small loss in those scenarios.


:P :P :P
One of my all-time favorite MightyOne post's if I do say so myself...
_____ _____
Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2008
:idea: MightyOne :idea: wrote:You cry your self to sleep saying,"man! I get stopped out and the trade eventually goes in the direction I was hoping to trade."

Do you think that you are the only one this is happening to?

Can you see how your words of defeat can be your words of victory if only you would utilize your observation?

The magnitude of the correction is ~equal to the time frame on which the breakout can be seen.

The larger the pivot the more long term traders are sitting with MASSIVE STOPS.
What is true for you on your time frame is true for a trader of a larger time frame.

Now that you understand that profit is being eliminated in ALL time frames you can piece together what is happening based on the reaction
and what action price will take based on your observation ie

"man! I get stopped out and the trade eventually goes in the direction I was hoping to trade."

I get stopped out (reaction)
It eventually goes in the direction I was hoping to trade (action)

http://kreslik.com/forums/userpix/6662_zero012_1.jpg


dojirock wrote:So the big question in my head...is how do I recognize the right side of the trade....this is where I am .

The following is part of your answer...

:idea: es/pip :idea: wrote:
brettnchrism wrote:Ok I am waiting for my ah ha moment here. My first one was seeing how traders get zero'd out and I completely see that all over my charts with the help of blubb's z line indicator.

Now ES said (if this trade/area holds where is the next group of traders sitting with held profits) Ok I see on the charts I posted that GJ just zero'd out profit holders in the 35 area and now made a new momo up on the hourly along with making a double bottom. Price is headed for the 25 zl which is a H4 H1 target. [highlight=violet]This is where I loose it. How can I tell if after the 25 zl gets hit that price will not continue up to the short holders or going to stop at the 25 area and continue down to the long holders.[/highlight] I did look at the H4 and there is a momo down bar so what I would say since we have a hourly momo up into a down h4 momo a long would not be advised. Anyway this is the last part of my puzzle how to determine directon after a zl has beeen hit. I posted GJ chart H4 and H1 for an example.








[highlight=violet]"This is where I loose it. How can I tell if after the 25 zl gets hit that price will not continue up to the short holders or going to stop at the 25 area and continue down to the long holders. "[/highlight]

[highlight=yellow]i don't know--- you cant know--- no one knows (except maybe MO)-----. if someone figures that out please let me know.[/highlight] All i know is the market lives to zero out other traders, it moves to and from each area and sometimes the area holds and sometimes it does not.

you have to think about what all the other traders did and are thinking about doing. and then trade off of their emotions. it is all about held profit and momentum.

so (keep in mind this is friday afternoon)

this what i would be looking at and thinking-- i don't trade this pair but this is what i would think when i look at this chart

in your 4 hr chart example if i saw the double bottom and notice the momo slowing into it.
Image

so if i was thinking of trading long i would dial down and look for a reason to trade long
Image
Image
if i was only referencing the h4 as far as held profit i would be targeting the magenta line. when price gets up there i would take my profit and then look inside and see whats happening to see if i am going to try and trade short back down to the yellow line.

if the PA and momo do not show that the magneta line is going to hold the price and we have momo up thru that area. Then i would be looking to get back in long( based on momo) and trade up to the next area of held profit--- which would be the red line.
Image


I am not sure i can explain what i do---- hell i am not sure i even know what i am doing when i am doing it---------- i just look at where we are where we came from and where we are going next---based on held profit------- and then trade to and from those areas based on momo.

momo shows the way

held profit is the destination


dojirock wrote:It may seem stupid but I now know what they mean by support and resistance being dynamic......when using those indicators...

http://kreslik.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=37519#37519
http://kreslik.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=38035#38035
http://kreslik.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=37620#37620
http://kreslik.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=38169#38169


dojirock wrote:Look forward to your input... Im on demo until i get this worked out..hehe

Doji


Looks like you and I are heading about the same way right about now. Hope you don't mind the overly-linked and quote-boxed reply. :smt024 :smt102
I'm actually about to quote-box & link a few things in my thread as well.
Plus, I can't wait to get back to my trading next week, enough of this reading old threads crap already!! :P
(Which reminds me, I have a special post for MO coming up...he has a little grudge against my posting style it seems :shock: :wink: )
Last edited by TygerKrane on Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

**Krane catches Tyger** !>I'm here to chew bubble gum and make major pips...and I'm all out of bubble gum.<!

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Postby TygerKrane » Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:05 am

dojirock wrote:I have to ask....
If, for your preferred terminology, mbars = MOMO, your definition is troubling...
Do I have that wrong?

This is what I think i know for sure....
Bodies in the direction of profit, they show you the way....
extremes are the wicks
If fails to close beyond the extreme after mbar.....then Key Reversal.
Doji

I'm sorry about that one, I probably got a bit nit-picky with my reply, I'm used to thinking of them as 2x the previous bar (as one of their simplest criteria anyways); at the time of my post "closing beyond previous extreme" seemed a bit too general, that's all...

~Krane

**Krane catches Tyger** !>I'm here to chew bubble gum and make major pips...and I'm all out of bubble gum.<!

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