ZLINES...

[Mr. Hyde]

OK...

Talking to Mr Hyde last night and at some point posted this over on Wanna's Journey of the ES thread:

''I am looking to always finish the day in profit. That's the goal.

That actually reminds me of an interesting psychological experiment I know. I'm on my phone now but when I kick things off again tomorrow, I will post it up and see what you guys say about it.''

He seemed to think it was a good idea, so you can blame him, lol.

Anyway, this is a kind of a follow on to our earlier discussions on the psychological side of trading and that is why I will post this here.

So. There is a devious question prospective new traders at a fund I happen to know of are asked at one of their initial interrogations - sorry, interviews

It goes like this:

''(In terms of your trading)...Define success?''

That's it - at this point the three guys on the other side of the desk will not take their eyes off you as they wait for your words of wisdom.

So what's your answer?

Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't.

This could be your whole career on the line, remember. No pressure, then...

Oh and here's a hint. The answer isn't ''to make money''.

Discuss.

[LeMercenaire]

Well done, guys. Interesting, honest (I think ), answers to the question I posed.

I think overall, you are all far too nice and self-effacing to be considered Fund-Trader material. Now believe me, that is a compliment and to be honest, I don't think any one of you would actually want to be a Fund-Trader.

self-effacing
ˌsɛlfɪˈfeɪsɪŋ

adjective
not claiming attention for oneself; retiring and modest.
"his demeanour was self-effacing, gracious, and polite"

The money is huge, for sure and of course, that would be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. Shy and retiring? Nah, not so much, lol.

There is, in fact, obviously no perfect or certainly ''correct'' answer to the question. In fact the question is only a means to an end. What it is designed to do is act as a key, a key to your personality and character. They already know that anyone wanting that job who hasn't been head-hunted (and so is in essence a free-agent) will crawl naked over broken glass and gouge the eyes out of his competition - and will continue to live by that ethos even when on the payroll.

What they want to know is will you lie about the fact in the interview?

Think about it. This is very telling. You know that they know what you're thinking. You have to decide whether this is actually what they want to hear. Do they want a person who is a liar on their books? Or do they want someone who acknowledges their faults, that could be seen as strengths, the way they are willing to do anything to make money. Do they want someone who will lie for them?

Are you still wondering why so many of these people burn out so quickly?

Are there any of you who still think it would be cool? (If there were any in the first place - I have a feeling that by your answers, there's not one of you who would want to touch this job with a barge-pole).

So, speaking of your answers...

Arkan said:
''Hello ! for me the success is to understand what the market is doing. Once it is completed it should be easy to finish the weeks in positive. The success is to be able to work for myself''.

Mira:
''To not lose money'' and ''Well.. I’m kidding btw. I think that success is relative and, in part, subjective.
To me success is reaching the personal goals, it doesn’t matter what they are''.

Leo:
''Success is want for your fellow trader, which you want for yourself. Can you imagine if the likes of Tro and Mo never existed?''

Mr Hyde:
''Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't''.

Every one of these are great answers for the age. Quite PC and very personal. Heartfelt. Just what the modern HR department looks for.

Those three Gorillas back in our hypothetical room, however. Mmmmm...

Mr Hyde being happy with what he has? How is that going to make him hungry enough to work the Japanese Desk for a month at a time without cracking as a result of no sleep?

Leo wanting his co-traders to have the same success he seeks for himself? ''Hey, there ain't no second place winner, only first place loser!''
Guys, I have actually heard that shouted in the face of a young female trader. Like something David Mamet would write, I swear.

Arkan's got a shot. He'd work in the analytics dept though. Very good at what he does but happy to work behind the scenes.

That leaves Mira...

Thing is. You know that joke you made? ''To not lose money''. To...Not...Lose...Money. Well, ya' nailed it. That is golden.

You see, this was my answer:

''To protect my capital, minimise my exposure to the market, be in the right place at the right time and come out ahead in the end''.

That, in essence is what a fund wants from its traders. Any serious one anyway, outside Hollywood. Thing is, I had a week to think of my answer via dry-runs of possible scenarios and believe me, if I had had to answer on the spot, or even the way I asked you guys, I would have probably answered in some combination of the answers you all gave.

The Fund makes money by being successful (duh!). Success breeds success. Money goes to money. I had figured that out and basically worked out the best way to fit that mission statement into my pitch. Did I lie? Does it matter? Both of us got what we wanted.

As it turns out, I didn't lie and have carried that ethos over into my own personal trading. My idea of success in trading was to not lose my initial investment (I didn't start with a lot) and to work with profits as quickly as possible (I had backers to repay).

Once I had figured that out, it dictated the kind of trading I wanted to specialise in, which as I've said before, meant moving from my Fund-Monkey Long-TF stuff to scalping.

What's that got to do with you guys? Well, that was the point of this exercise all along - to find out your base ethos and to see if the trading you are using just now actually matches up with that way of thinking.

If it does, then it's all about fine-tuning and getting as good as you can get.

If it doesn't, then better to find out now - and let's get on with helping you find the style that will get you to your definition of success.

I hope that this has been of some kind of use. Sometimes I get carried away. I have an editor who emails me with ''cut it!..cut it!..cut it!'' in the heading and no message, as she knows that sometimes I get too close to the material and need someone else to tell me to get a grip and...well let's not get me started on film-making, or we really will be here all night

Trade well all. Onward and upward.

[Leoheart]

Well done, guys. Interesting, honest (I think ), answers to the question I posed.

I think overall, you are all far too nice and self-effacing to be considered Fund-Trader material. Now believe me, that is a compliment and to be honest, I don't think any one of you would actually want to be a Fund-Trader.

self-effacing
ˌsɛlfɪˈfeɪsɪŋ

adjective
not claiming attention for oneself; retiring and modest.
"his demeanour was self-effacing, gracious, and polite"

The money is huge, for sure and of course, that would be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. Shy and retiring? Nah, not so much, lol.

There is, in fact, obviously no perfect or certainly ''correct'' answer to the question. In fact the question is only a means to an end. What it is designed to do is act as a key, a key to your personality and character. They already know that anyone wanting that job who hasn't been head-hunted (and so is in essence a free-agent) will crawl naked over broken glass and gouge the eyes out of his competition - and will continue to live by that ethos even when on the payroll.

What they want to know is will you lie about the fact in the interview?

Think about it. This is very telling. You know that they know what you're thinking. You have to decide whether this is actually what they want to hear. Do they want a person who is a liar on their books? Or do they want someone who acknowledges their faults, that could be seen as strengths, the way they are willing to do anything to make money. Do they want someone who will lie for them?

Are you still wondering why so many of these people burn out so quickly?

Are there any of you who still think it would be cool? (If there were any in the first place - I have a feeling that by your answers, there's not one of you who would want to touch this job with a barge-pole).

So, speaking of your answers...

Arkan said:
''Hello ! for me the success is to understand what the market is doing. Once it is completed it should be easy to finish the weeks in positive. The success is to be able to work for myself''.

Mira:
''To not lose money'' and ''Well.. I’m kidding btw. I think that success is relative and, in part, subjective.
To me success is reaching the personal goals, it doesn’t matter what they are''.

Leo:
''Success is want for your fellow trader, which you want for yourself. Can you imagine if the likes of Tro and Mo never existed?''

Mr Hyde:
''Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't''.

Every one of these are great answers for the age. Quite PC and very personal. Heartfelt. Just what the modern HR department looks for.

Those three Gorillas back in our hypothetical room, however. Mmmmm...

Mr Hyde being happy with what he has? How is that going to make him hungry enough to work the Japanese Desk for a month at a time without cracking as a result of no sleep?

Leo wanting his co-traders to have the same success he seeks for himself? ''Hey, there ain't no second place winner, only first place loser!''
Guys, I have actually heard that shouted in the face of a young female trader. Like something David Mamet would write, I swear.

Arkan's got a shot. He'd work in the analytics dept though. Very good at what he does but happy to work behind the scenes.

That leaves Mira...

Thing is. You know that joke you made? ''To not lose money''. To...Not...Lose...Money. Well, ya' nailed it. That is golden.

You see, this was my answer:

''To protect my capital, minimise my exposure to the market, be in the right place at the right time and come out ahead in the end''.

That, in essence is what a fund wants from its traders. Any serious one anyway, outside Hollywood. Thing is, I had a week to think of my answer via dry-runs of possible scenarios and believe me, if I had had to answer on the spot, or even the way I asked you guys, I would have probably answered in some combination of the answers you all gave.

The Fund makes money by being successful (duh!). Success breeds success. Money goes to money. I had figured that out and basically worked out the best way to fit that mission statement into my pitch. Did I lie? Does it matter? Both of us got what we wanted.

As it turns out, I didn't lie and have carried that ethos over into my own personal trading. My idea of success in trading was to not lose my initial investment (I didn't start with a lot) and to work with profits as quickly as possible (I had backers to repay).

Once I had figured that out, it dictated the kind of trading I wanted to specialise in, which as I've said before, meant moving from my Fund-Monkey Long-TF stuff to scalping.

What's that got to do with you guys? Well, that was the point of this exercise all along - to find out your base ethos and to see if the trading you are using just now actually matches up with that way of thinking.

If it does, then it's all about fine-tuning and getting as good as you can get.

If it doesn't, then better to find out now - and let's get on with helping you find the style that will get you to your definition of success.

I hope that this has been of some kind of use. Sometimes I get carried away. I have an editor who emails me with ''cut it!..cut it!..cut it!'' in the heading and no message, as she knows that sometimes I get too close to the material and need someone else to tell me to get a grip and...well let's not get me started on film-making, or we really will be here all night

Trade well all. Onward and upward.

Dude, what the hell did you smoke today That is was interesting & length response. I knew I wasn't 'firm' material, I can honestly care less to work for a firm + me = terrible lair. What is all this talk "be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. " We risk OPM all the time

I am sorry my definition of success was probably out of context with what you were asking for. I did not see myself sitting in room facing a bunch of dorks. I apologize for messing up your experiment.

What I meant is, when a group of trades that do not have the formal educational background or connections to be interviewed or placed at these 'firms' yet raise each other up and succeed anyway, is that no a true definition of success & success at its finest.

[Leoheart]

Well done, guys. Interesting, honest (I think ), answers to the question I posed.

I think overall, you are all far too nice and self-effacing to be considered Fund-Trader material. Now believe me, that is a compliment and to be honest, I don't think any one of you would actually want to be a Fund-Trader.

self-effacing
ˌsɛlfɪˈfeɪsɪŋ

adjective
not claiming attention for oneself; retiring and modest.
"his demeanour was self-effacing, gracious, and polite"

The money is huge, for sure and of course, that would be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. Shy and retiring? Nah, not so much, lol.

There is, in fact, obviously no perfect or certainly ''correct'' answer to the question. In fact the question is only a means to an end. What it is designed to do is act as a key, a key to your personality and character. They already know that anyone wanting that job who hasn't been head-hunted (and so is in essence a free-agent) will crawl naked over broken glass and gouge the eyes out of his competition - and will continue to live by that ethos even when on the payroll.

What they want to know is will you lie about the fact in the interview?

Think about it. This is very telling. You know that they know what you're thinking. You have to decide whether this is actually what they want to hear. Do they want a person who is a liar on their books? Or do they want someone who acknowledges their faults, that could be seen as strengths, the way they are willing to do anything to make money. Do they want someone who will lie for them?

Are you still wondering why so many of these people burn out so quickly?

Are there any of you who still think it would be cool? (If there were any in the first place - I have a feeling that by your answers, there's not one of you who would want to touch this job with a barge-pole).

So, speaking of your answers...

Arkan said:
''Hello ! for me the success is to understand what the market is doing. Once it is completed it should be easy to finish the weeks in positive. The success is to be able to work for myself''.

Mira:
''To not lose money'' and ''Well.. I’m kidding btw. I think that success is relative and, in part, subjective.
To me success is reaching the personal goals, it doesn’t matter what they are''.

Leo:
''Success is want for your fellow trader, which you want for yourself. Can you imagine if the likes of Tro and Mo never existed?''

Mr Hyde:
''Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't''.

Every one of these are great answers for the age. Quite PC and very personal. Heartfelt. Just what the modern HR department looks for.

Those three Gorillas back in our hypothetical room, however. Mmmmm...

Mr Hyde being happy with what he has? How is that going to make him hungry enough to work the Japanese Desk for a month at a time without cracking as a result of no sleep?

Leo wanting his co-traders to have the same success he seeks for himself? ''Hey, there ain't no second place winner, only first place loser!''
Guys, I have actually heard that shouted in the face of a young female trader. Like something David Mamet would write, I swear.

Arkan's got a shot. He'd work in the analytics dept though. Very good at what he does but happy to work behind the scenes.

That leaves Mira...

Thing is. You know that joke you made? ''To not lose money''. To...Not...Lose...Money. Well, ya' nailed it. That is golden.

You see, this was my answer:

''To protect my capital, minimise my exposure to the market, be in the right place at the right time and come out ahead in the end''.

That, in essence is what a fund wants from its traders. Any serious one anyway, outside Hollywood. Thing is, I had a week to think of my answer via dry-runs of possible scenarios and believe me, if I had had to answer on the spot, or even the way I asked you guys, I would have probably answered in some combination of the answers you all gave.

The Fund makes money by being successful (duh!). Success breeds success. Money goes to money. I had figured that out and basically worked out the best way to fit that mission statement into my pitch. Did I lie? Does it matter? Both of us got what we wanted.

As it turns out, I didn't lie and have carried that ethos over into my own personal trading. My idea of success in trading was to not lose my initial investment (I didn't start with a lot) and to work with profits as quickly as possible (I had backers to repay).

Once I had figured that out, it dictated the kind of trading I wanted to specialise in, which as I've said before, meant moving from my Fund-Monkey Long-TF stuff to scalping.

What's that got to do with you guys? Well, that was the point of this exercise all along - to find out your base ethos and to see if the trading you are using just now actually matches up with that way of thinking.

If it does, then it's all about fine-tuning and getting as good as you can get.

If it doesn't, then better to find out now - and let's get on with helping you find the style that will get you to your definition of success.

I hope that this has been of some kind of use. Sometimes I get carried away. I have an editor who emails me with ''cut it!..cut it!..cut it!'' in the heading and no message, as she knows that sometimes I get too close to the material and need someone else to tell me to get a grip and...well let's not get me started on film-making, or we really will be here all night

Trade well all. Onward and upward.

Dude, what the hell did you smoke today That is was interesting & length response. I knew I wasn't 'firm' material, I can honestly care less to work for a firm + me = terrible lair. What is all this talk "be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. " We risk OPM all the time

I am sorry my definition of success was probably out of context with what you were asking for. I did not see myself sitting in room facing a bunch of dorks. I apologize for messing up your experiment.

What I mean is, when a group of trades that do not have the formal educational background or connections to be interviewed or placed at these 'firms' yet raise each other up and succeed anyway, is that not a true definition of success & success at its finest.

[LeMercenaire]

Well done, guys. Interesting, honest (I think ), answers to the question I posed.

I think overall, you are all far too nice and self-effacing to be considered Fund-Trader material. Now believe me, that is a compliment and to be honest, I don't think any one of you would actually want to be a Fund-Trader.

self-effacing
ˌsɛlfɪˈfeɪsɪŋ

adjective
not claiming attention for oneself; retiring and modest.
"his demeanour was self-effacing, gracious, and polite"

The money is huge, for sure and of course, that would be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. Shy and retiring? Nah, not so much, lol.

There is, in fact, obviously no perfect or certainly ''correct'' answer to the question. In fact the question is only a means to an end. What it is designed to do is act as a key, a key to your personality and character. They already know that anyone wanting that job who hasn't been head-hunted (and so is in essence a free-agent) will crawl naked over broken glass and gouge the eyes out of his competition - and will continue to live by that ethos even when on the payroll.

What they want to know is will you lie about the fact in the interview?

Think about it. This is very telling. You know that they know what you're thinking. You have to decide whether this is actually what they want to hear. Do they want a person who is a liar on their books? Or do they want someone who acknowledges their faults, that could be seen as strengths, the way they are willing to do anything to make money. Do they want someone who will lie for them?

Are you still wondering why so many of these people burn out so quickly?

Are there any of you who still think it would be cool? (If there were any in the first place - I have a feeling that by your answers, there's not one of you who would want to touch this job with a barge-pole).

So, speaking of your answers...

Arkan said:
''Hello ! for me the success is to understand what the market is doing. Once it is completed it should be easy to finish the weeks in positive. The success is to be able to work for myself''.

Mira:
''To not lose money'' and ''Well.. I’m kidding btw. I think that success is relative and, in part, subjective.
To me success is reaching the personal goals, it doesn’t matter what they are''.

Leo:
''Success is want for your fellow trader, which you want for yourself. Can you imagine if the likes of Tro and Mo never existed?''

Mr Hyde:
''Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't''.

Every one of these are great answers for the age. Quite PC and very personal. Heartfelt. Just what the modern HR department looks for.

Those three Gorillas back in our hypothetical room, however. Mmmmm...

Mr Hyde being happy with what he has? How is that going to make him hungry enough to work the Japanese Desk for a month at a time without cracking as a result of no sleep?

Leo wanting his co-traders to have the same success he seeks for himself? ''Hey, there ain't no second place winner, only first place loser!''
Guys, I have actually heard that shouted in the face of a young female trader. Like something David Mamet would write, I swear.

Arkan's got a shot. He'd work in the analytics dept though. Very good at what he does but happy to work behind the scenes.

That leaves Mira...

Thing is. You know that joke you made? ''To not lose money''. To...Not...Lose...Money. Well, ya' nailed it. That is golden.

You see, this was my answer:

''To protect my capital, minimise my exposure to the market, be in the right place at the right time and come out ahead in the end''.

That, in essence is what a fund wants from its traders. Any serious one anyway, outside Hollywood. Thing is, I had a week to think of my answer via dry-runs of possible scenarios and believe me, if I had had to answer on the spot, or even the way I asked you guys, I would have probably answered in some combination of the answers you all gave.

The Fund makes money by being successful (duh!). Success breeds success. Money goes to money. I had figured that out and basically worked out the best way to fit that mission statement into my pitch. Did I lie? Does it matter? Both of us got what we wanted.

As it turns out, I didn't lie and have carried that ethos over into my own personal trading. My idea of success in trading was to not lose my initial investment (I didn't start with a lot) and to work with profits as quickly as possible (I had backers to repay).

Once I had figured that out, it dictated the kind of trading I wanted to specialise in, which as I've said before, meant moving from my Fund-Monkey Long-TF stuff to scalping.

What's that got to do with you guys? Well, that was the point of this exercise all along - to find out your base ethos and to see if the trading you are using just now actually matches up with that way of thinking.

If it does, then it's all about fine-tuning and getting as good as you can get.

If it doesn't, then better to find out now - and let's get on with helping you find the style that will get you to your definition of success.

I hope that this has been of some kind of use. Sometimes I get carried away. I have an editor who emails me with ''cut it!..cut it!..cut it!'' in the heading and no message, as she knows that sometimes I get too close to the material and need someone else to tell me to get a grip and...well let's not get me started on film-making, or we really will be here all night

Trade well all. Onward and upward.

Dude, what the hell did you smoke today That is was interesting & length response. I knew I wasn't 'firm' material, I can honestly care less to work for a firm + me = terrible lair. What is all this talk "be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. " We risk OPM all the time

I am sorry my definition of success was probably out of context with what you were asking for. I did not see myself sitting in room facing a bunch of dorks. I apologize for messing up your experiment.

What I meant is, when a group of trades that do not have the formal educational background or connections to be interviewed or placed at these 'firms' yet raise each other up and succeed anyway, is that no a true definition of success & success at its finest.

I knew the ''Other peoples' money'' thing would be picked up wrong. What we call here OPM is not what I meant. That is taking other peoples' money, traders who are trading against us and making it work for us (sorry if that's wrong, I just took it to mean that, I haven't really looked into the concept at all).

What I'm talking about is using your trading bank, which is made up of other peoples' money, to make them money (and by extension, yourself). They are relying on you to make them their pension, or whatever.

That's not something that a lot of people can do.

You are a true altruist. Genuinely wishing everyone success. Your idea of success hits the mark in a very modern definition of the word. This is actually a relatively new point of view.

My eventual point was to ask how each individual trader's version of success can help them become better traders. You are the team player and the group is ultimately stronger because of it.

The reverse holds true - as the group's strength grows, so will yours.

[IgazI]

Every time I see a giant wall of text I think about how grateful I am that TRO makes videos

[Leoheart]

Well done, guys. Interesting, honest (I think ), answers to the question I posed.

I think overall, you are all far too nice and self-effacing to be considered Fund-Trader material. Now believe me, that is a compliment and to be honest, I don't think any one of you would actually want to be a Fund-Trader.

self-effacing
ˌsɛlfɪˈfeɪsɪŋ

adjective
not claiming attention for oneself; retiring and modest.
"his demeanour was self-effacing, gracious, and polite"

The money is huge, for sure and of course, that would be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. Shy and retiring? Nah, not so much, lol.

There is, in fact, obviously no perfect or certainly ''correct'' answer to the question. In fact the question is only a means to an end. What it is designed to do is act as a key, a key to your personality and character. They already know that anyone wanting that job who hasn't been head-hunted (and so is in essence a free-agent) will crawl naked over broken glass and gouge the eyes out of his competition - and will continue to live by that ethos even when on the payroll.

What they want to know is will you lie about the fact in the interview?

Think about it. This is very telling. You know that they know what you're thinking. You have to decide whether this is actually what they want to hear. Do they want a person who is a liar on their books? Or do they want someone who acknowledges their faults, that could be seen as strengths, the way they are willing to do anything to make money. Do they want someone who will lie for them?

Are you still wondering why so many of these people burn out so quickly?

Are there any of you who still think it would be cool? (If there were any in the first place - I have a feeling that by your answers, there's not one of you who would want to touch this job with a barge-pole).

So, speaking of your answers...

Arkan said:
''Hello ! for me the success is to understand what the market is doing. Once it is completed it should be easy to finish the weeks in positive. The success is to be able to work for myself''.

Mira:
''To not lose money'' and ''Well.. I’m kidding btw. I think that success is relative and, in part, subjective.
To me success is reaching the personal goals, it doesn’t matter what they are''.

Leo:
''Success is want for your fellow trader, which you want for yourself. Can you imagine if the likes of Tro and Mo never existed?''

Mr Hyde:
''Achieveing your goals no matter the obstacles you face or times you fail. Being happy with what you have and not what you don't''.

Every one of these are great answers for the age. Quite PC and very personal. Heartfelt. Just what the modern HR department looks for.

Those three Gorillas back in our hypothetical room, however. Mmmmm...

Mr Hyde being happy with what he has? How is that going to make him hungry enough to work the Japanese Desk for a month at a time without cracking as a result of no sleep?

Leo wanting his co-traders to have the same success he seeks for himself? ''Hey, there ain't no second place winner, only first place loser!''
Guys, I have actually heard that shouted in the face of a young female trader. Like something David Mamet would write, I swear.

Arkan's got a shot. He'd work in the analytics dept though. Very good at what he does but happy to work behind the scenes.

That leaves Mira...

Thing is. You know that joke you made? ''To not lose money''. To...Not...Lose...Money. Well, ya' nailed it. That is golden.

You see, this was my answer:

''To protect my capital, minimise my exposure to the market, be in the right place at the right time and come out ahead in the end''.

That, in essence is what a fund wants from its traders. Any serious one anyway, outside Hollywood. Thing is, I had a week to think of my answer via dry-runs of possible scenarios and believe me, if I had had to answer on the spot, or even the way I asked you guys, I would have probably answered in some combination of the answers you all gave.

The Fund makes money by being successful (duh!). Success breeds success. Money goes to money. I had figured that out and basically worked out the best way to fit that mission statement into my pitch. Did I lie? Does it matter? Both of us got what we wanted.

As it turns out, I didn't lie and have carried that ethos over into my own personal trading. My idea of success in trading was to not lose my initial investment (I didn't start with a lot) and to work with profits as quickly as possible (I had backers to repay).

Once I had figured that out, it dictated the kind of trading I wanted to specialise in, which as I've said before, meant moving from my Fund-Monkey Long-TF stuff to scalping.

What's that got to do with you guys? Well, that was the point of this exercise all along - to find out your base ethos and to see if the trading you are using just now actually matches up with that way of thinking.

If it does, then it's all about fine-tuning and getting as good as you can get.

If it doesn't, then better to find out now - and let's get on with helping you find the style that will get you to your definition of success.

I hope that this has been of some kind of use. Sometimes I get carried away. I have an editor who emails me with ''cut it!..cut it!..cut it!'' in the heading and no message, as she knows that sometimes I get too close to the material and need someone else to tell me to get a grip and...well let's not get me started on film-making, or we really will be here all night

Trade well all. Onward and upward.

Dude, what the hell did you smoke today That is was interesting & length response. I knew I wasn't 'firm' material, I can honestly care less to work for a firm + me = terrible lair. What is all this talk "be nice but the kind of person it takes to not only make money for themselves but to do so risking other people's money, is a certain kind of complex character. " We risk OPM all the time

I am sorry my definition of success was probably out of context with what you were asking for. I did not see myself sitting in room facing a bunch of dorks. I apologize for messing up your experiment.

What I meant is, when a group of trades that do not have the formal educational background or connections to be interviewed or placed at these 'firms' yet raise each other up and succeed anyway, is that no a true definition of success & success at its finest.

I knew the ''Other peoples' money'' thing would be picked up wrong. What we call here OPM is not what I meant. That is taking other peoples' money, traders who are trading against us and making it work for us (sorry if that's wrong, I just took it to mean that, I haven't really looked into the concept at all).

What I'm talking about is using your trading bank, which is made up of other peoples' money, to make them money (and by extension, yourself). They are relying on you to make them their pension, or whatever.

That's not something that a lot of people can do.

You are a true altruist. Genuinely wishing everyone success. Your idea of success hits the mark in a very modern definition of the word. This is actually a relatively new point of view.

My eventual point was to ask how each individual trader's version of success can help them become better traders. You are the team player and the group is ultimately stronger because of it.

The reverse holds true - as the group's strength grows, so will yours.

I use the term OPM very loosely. To me it just means money that is my account which I didn’t originally invest. Whether it’s won from other people or managing a fund for others. Obviously in my case this would be the former.

Yes I am all for the team when it comes to learning from folks and help improve folks . This wasn’t always the case. By nature I am extremely competitive and somewhat of a egomaniac.
In trading i spent years indulging in fantasies and living in a bubble ignoring the truth & lessons from some amazing folks. All because I had something to prove I had a special outlook/special system etc.. I saw other traders (people) point of view
As treats and A direct assault on what I thought to be true. So the ignoring continued until I realized something was really wrong. I did a lot of soul searching spiritual/psychology work (still do) on myself which has led to where I am now. Oh yeah, and after discovering layer 3 it’s game over .

All of this “love all people, let’s go hugh rainbows talk aside” Lem if I see on the other side of my trade trying to scalp some pips I will Tear You Apart .

[LeMercenaire]

Every time I see a giant wall of text I think about how grateful I am that TRO makes videos

"Schwiiing!!!'' Lol.

[arkan1976]

Good morning!
The entrie was a little late....

[arkan1976]

It seems that the train has reached the final station